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PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:02 pm 
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Location: FRA
I will prevent to occupy another thread http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4325
thats the main reason for this one.

In this thread we talk about two different kinds of intervals:
VOmax and MAD

In both cases it would be great, when we should know HOW to do, like:

MAP:
30min warming up 100W/80C
12min 300W/80C
20min 100W/80C
12min 300W/80C
20min 100W/80C
12min 300W/80C
20min cool down 75W/80C

or

30min warming up 100W/80C
04min 400W/80C
20min 100W/80C
04min 400W/80C
20min 100W/80C
04min 400W/80C
20min cool down 75W/80C


VOmax:
...
...



I don't know if I am right with that, but I guess it would be interesting for much people who want to train efficient.

Thanks
Taaboo

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Think about the lightest part on your bike? Your brain! -Use it and do not buy any component, but the one which suits your riding style...


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Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:02 pm 


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:53 pm 
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This intervals are the typical ones focused on raising your functional threshold (FT: maximum power you can sustain for an hour).
15 mins warm up
20 mins @FT power
5mins off
20 mins @FT power
15 mins cool down.
This really work...


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 4:01 pm 
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Is functional threshold the same as lactate threshold? If not, whats the diff?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 4:10 pm 
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homegrown wrote:
Is functional threshold the same as lactate threshold? If not, whats the diff?

Im not an expert, but I know that there are several definitions of Lactate Threshold, one of them correlates highly with FT.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 12:29 pm 
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I´m pretty sure that Vo2 max is geneticly decided and for most of us it takes alot of training to improve and if you improve it´s only marginal
if you want to improve fast do "Bäckstedt" intervalls hillclimbing with high gear and a very very low rpm
you can improve with 20-30% in a couple of weeks
the bad part is you lose it as fast too

Marlboro Man wrote:
Try riding up every climb in the biggest gear you can muster even if you're down to 4 RPM. 100metres from the top, whack it in the smallest gear you have and sprint to the crest of the hill. Do it all seated.

Be warned. This hurts a lot but I was told to do it by the most recent winner of Paris Roubaix. You should see him do this drill. Vertical hill in 53x11


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 5:40 pm 
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20-30% improvement in 2weeks?? :shock: The only way to do that is by doping.. I do not think Backstedt is doped, but I believe your estimate is a bit off :wink:


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:36 pm 
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okr wrote:
20-30% improvement in 2weeks?? :shock:


It´s on cell level! you increase the mitochondria
growth in muscle tissue.
They can be increased by 20-30% (unfit persons can increase with 300%!!!at the gym) with this work and if you have more mitochondria each does less work for the same output
hence your legs last longer at work below lactate threshold.
This you can do in training in a couple of weeks but you lose mitochondria as quick as you gain them
but it´s still easier than elevate your lactate threshold.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 10:59 am 
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Location: Sydney, Australia
Most people I know train for results over years, not just weeks.
In that time frame it is very possible to change your Vo2 max.

I've been doing the grinding excercise on hills and I've found it helps with strong headwinds, but I need to find a longer hill :?

How do people measure their LT?
I measured mine by heart rate, but it's changed alot since I started.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 9:49 am 
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@Bruiser:
The only exact way to mesure your LT is to made a Lactat test, based on time and Watt.
I do that two times a year. The first in begin of December for the Basic work and the second in the begin of March.

The test is like:
increase the power every 5 min by the half amount of your total weight. After each step your earlap will be picked for drop of blood to messure the Lactat. Also your HR will be recorded.
Start:
10min warming up HR<100 and W = 100. The cadence should be the same as in the test.
1. step: 1,5 x weight (e.g. 75Kg) = 112,5W 5min
2. step: 2,0 x weight = 150W 5min
3. step: 2,5 x weight = 187,5W 5min
4. step: 3,0 x weight = 225W 5min
5. step: 3,5 x weight = 262,5W 5min
6. step: 4,0 x weight = 300W 5min
and so on...

for me was the finish comes after two minutes on step 7.
The result was, except of loose 4-5Kg weight until April, that I have to train more basement as in the last year with a lower HR.

My 2,0 MilliMol Lactat threshold is on 137bpm, but my 4,0MM is on 158bpm, the individual O²threshold was at 165 or 4,6MM Lactat.

Since the test on the 5th of December, I train nearly 800KM and mostly in the zone until 137bpm. Its very boring and cold but I feel the first enhancements.

If you ride a lot, you should made a test. Equal if you would train for some races or for you private fun. It's just better to kow your threshold.

Cheers
Taaboo

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Think about the lightest part on your bike? Your brain! -Use it and do not buy any component, but the one which suits your riding style...


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 10:18 am 
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Perry wrote:
I´m pretty sure that Vo2 max is geneticly decided and for most of us it takes alot of training to improve and if you improve it´s only marginal
if you want to improve fast do "Bäckstedt" intervalls hillclimbing with high gear and a very very low rpm
you can improve with 20-30% in a couple of weeks
the bad part is you lose it as fast too

Marlboro Man wrote:
Try riding up every climb in the biggest gear you can muster even if you're down to 4 RPM. 100metres from the top, whack it in the smallest gear you have and sprint to the crest of the hill. Do it all seated.

Be warned. This hurts a lot but I was told to do it by the most recent winner of Paris Roubaix. You should see him do this drill. Vertical hill in 53x11


The training above trains only the max. power and should be done after a long periode of basement- and muscle bodywork training. -My climbing experience told that to me: You don't start climbing by pull up with one finger.

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Think about the lightest part on your bike? Your brain! -Use it and do not buy any component, but the one which suits your riding style...


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2005 2:59 pm 
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taaboo, do you find that you lose much of your "spin" when you start doing these hills repeats? I like the possibility of gaining power (I only weigh 137 pounds I need power!) but I also like that I have a fast cadence 105-110 riding normal, comfortable. I'm guessing the body is relatively elastic and can maybe get the spin back after a few weeks?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2005 4:04 pm 
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@homegrown:
I never done such a hillclimb...:-)
My opinion to get power is: have a hilly ride for 2-3hours with your max. HR near to 4MM Lactat, but not above!
Then drive to a constant climb with aprox. 500-700m min. lengh (for race 5-7%, for mtb 7-10%), take the highest gear and start to climb from the stand as fast as you can for 30sec., slow down and wait until you HR will be in your "fat burning zone". Start again. Do that 10 times. Go down when you reach the top and start again until you have the 10 fullfilled.
Take a breake with low power, doing nothing was wrong.
Then start with the slow rpm-hillclimb like describt in the postings above.
Cool down

The first part is to train your red muscle fibres, the second is for the white, which only works with oxigene (when my memory is right).

Try this in the last parts of your preperations and take this at the end of an
accending 3day intervall.

I will do that at the end of March, when I am back from my "training camp" and at least 4 weeks before my first race.

JUST FOR YOUR INFO: I am not a pro, but only interested in efficient training for my hobby -MTB Marathon races!

Good luck!
Taaboo

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Think about the lightest part on your bike? Your brain! -Use it and do not buy any component, but the one which suits your riding style...


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Posted: Thu Jan 27, 2005 4:04 pm 


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