Training with power FTP & LTHR advice

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ACDC
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:34 pm

by ACDC

Just after some help/advice, this has been my first week training with power(stages power meter). Having trained exclusively with HR for the last 10+ years. I've not been doing anything specific over the last week, some short 10min intervals on the trainer and some long/short steady rides just to get the feel for pacing,collect some data and learning to use the power meter and various data fields and setups on the Garmin.

I did my first 20min FTP test on the trainer at the start of the week following the protocol in the training & racing with a power meter book. It was a pretty poor example of a test to be fair and as it was my first test I wasn't expecting much, started out too hard and slowly died towards the end but I finished with pretty much nothing left. My FTP worked out @173w, yes I know not fantastic by any means, the avg HR for the 20min test was about 170 which is typical for my previous LTHR tests that I've carried out in the past so I decided to stick with the FTP of 173 and calculate my power zones 1-7.

I have done a few 10min x3 intervals and am able to hold 180-200w fairly easily for the 10 mins and my HR never goes anywhere near my LTHR, max at about 155, which is within my HR zone 3.

Any advice on this :welcome:

mr4fox
Posts: 276
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 2:01 pm

by mr4fox

strange...sounds like you should probably ignore that first FTP test.

its been a couple weeks since you posted so you may well have figured this out but...

When your HR hits ca 155bpm@200w is it increasing gradually over the 10 min or is it climbing quickly in the last few minutes? if it feels like you can hold 200 watts easily for 10 min then it sounds like you should be able to easily start around 200w and see what happens over 20min. If 170bpm avg is typical for a 20min threshold test then your threshold HR is 161 (95%) accordnig to Coggan. Based off your 10min interval at 200w my guess is your ftp is over 200w. Just start a bit easier next time. it takes a few goes to get it right. you might be better off just doing threshold intervals and watching for HR to stabilise around 161 to get a closer estimate before you do an all out test.

When i do a 20min interval at 100@FTP it normally takes my hr about 12min to hit threshold where it more or less stabilises. but if i were to do 10min over threshold it would come up quite a bit quicker. its been 3 months since my last all out 20min interval so cant remember what to expect from my HR. if just started looking at avg HR when doing threshold intervals to estimate my FTP. but i know what to expect from my HR when riding a steady state 20min interval @100%....and i find this less disruptive to my training schedule.

My guess is you need to retest when youre ready. make sure you have calibrated the stages using the correct callibration method (crank arm at 6 O'colck?? or what ever it is for stages). i think youre meant to do this every ride with the same method.

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ACDC
Posts: 69
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:34 pm

by ACDC

mr4fox, thanks for the reply. Yes, as you suggested I've decided to ignore the first ftp results. I've completed lots of intervals on the trainer 3x10, 3x12, 2x20's over the last few weeks and completed some long steady rides and some shorter tempo rides just to get used to pacing with the power meter and collect some data. It would look like you are right in suggesting an ftp above 200w from what I can interpret from the data I've got so far, for the last few weeks I've been using an ftp of 190w as a guide until I re-test again and still think this is a bit low. Today I completed 3x12 at 105% ftp (avg 200w) my HR rose from about 135 to 170 for each interval whilst holding 200w steady and I found this not to uncomfortable. I had an avg HR for each interval of around 155 and if I was using HR only I'd have been pushing for an avg HR of >165. So far I've found it a world of difference using power than HR alone and I'm loving training with it, I've read lots concerning HR relative to power and I'm now starting to understand this aspect much better. As they say every day is a school day and as a new power user I have lots to learn, thanks for your help :D

chanthony91
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2016 8:34 pm

by chanthony91

mr4fox wrote:strange...sounds like you should probably ignore that first FTP test.

its been a couple weeks since you posted so you may well have figured this out but...

When your HR hits ca 155bpm@200w is it increasing gradually over the 10 min or is it climbing quickly in the last few minutes? if it feels like you can hold 200 watts easily for 10 min then it sounds like you should be able to easily start around 200w and see what happens over 20min. If 170bpm avg is typical for a 20min threshold test then your threshold HR is 161 (95%) accordnig to Coggan. Based off your 10min interval at 200w my guess is your ftp is over 200w. Just start a bit easier next time. it takes a few goes to get it right. you might be better off just doing threshold intervals and watching for HR to stabilise around 161 to get a closer estimate before you do an all out test.

When i do a 20min interval at 100@FTP it normally takes my hr about 12min to hit threshold where it more or less stabilises. but if i were to do 10min over threshold it would come up quite a bit quicker. its been 3 months since my last all out 20min interval so cant remember what to expect from my HR. if just started looking at avg HR when doing threshold intervals to estimate my FTP. but i know what to expect from my HR when riding a steady state 20min interval @100%....and i find this less disruptive to my training schedule.

My guess is you need to retest when youre ready. make sure you have calibrated the stages using the correct callibration method (crank arm at 6 O'colck?? or what ever it is for stages). i think youre meant to do this every ride with the same method.


retest is the best option. but looks like you're going in the right direction :)

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