3 & 5 min Vo2 max interval questions

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devinci
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by devinci

with longer rest inbetween I'd say you will work more towards vo2max power and it will certainly include an anaerobic portion to the effort. With 1min rest, your power would be much lower, more aerobic focused.

Not that 3min is anaerobic but if you start them HARD there is an interesting anaerobic component which allows you to reach vo2max quicker.

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KWalker
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by KWalker

duz10s wrote:I did 4 x 3 min Vo2 intervals this morning indoor on my watt bike and they seemed moderate so i'm guessing my base FTP has increased so I may need to re test my FTP or jump up what numbers i should be hitting for Vo2.

I don't find 3 min intervals as hard as others and tend to do between 6-10 a session usually based off my best 5min MMP.
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MattSoutherden
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by MattSoutherden

duz10s wrote:I did 4 x 3 min Vo2 intervals this morning indoor on my watt bike and they seemed moderate so i'm guessing my base FTP has increased so I may need to re test my FTP or jump up what numbers i should be hitting for Vo2.


My FTP is about 310-320 (haven't done a test or race for months) but I do 3min intervals at about 410-420W (if I'm aiming for a horrific death around rep 6).

I think a big part of 'how hard' is how good your FTP is, and what your CP profile looks like.
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beardking
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by beardking

did the intervals the way TW advises yesterday as I said in my previous post THEY REALLY F***ING HURT :twisted:
tried my best to hit as big a number for the first 30 seconds then whatever i could after that. have hit 3 all averaging over 400watts before but trying to get a big number on the first parts seems to be a lot tougher than doing them paced. these were all out, heart rate a few beats off max at the end of each nearly falling off my bike at the end of 3 minutes

interval 1 :- 30s @ 624watts then 2:30 @ 447watts = 476.5watts 3min average
interval 2 :- 30s @ 604watts + 2:30 @ 359 watts = 399watts avg
interval 3 :- 30s @572 watts + 2:30 @ 354watts = 390.33 avg
interval 4 :- 30s @ 540 + 2:30 @ 347watts = 379avg

my ftp is around 320

KWalker
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by KWalker

MattSoutherden wrote:
duz10s wrote:I did 4 x 3 min Vo2 intervals this morning indoor on my watt bike and they seemed moderate so i'm guessing my base FTP has increased so I may need to re test my FTP or jump up what numbers i should be hitting for Vo2.


My FTP is about 310-320 (haven't done a test or race for months) but I do 3min intervals at about 410-420W (if I'm aiming for a horrific death around rep 6).

I think a big part of 'how hard' is how good your FTP is, and what your CP profile looks like.


You're not really hitting the L5 or circa vo2 max power if you're doing them that much higher. Assuming that your FTP is 320, your well into the anaerobic range far above vo2 max power.

For reference, I do my 5 min intervals around what you're doing yours at, but my FTP is 353.
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mrlobber
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by mrlobber

I've been doing 3 min intervals in the range of 116...120% of my FTP, and while they hurt, a can do 7-8 repeats "relatively" easy so there isn't that "hardest of all intervals" feeling for me out there.

For reference, my 5min max MMP is approx 128% of FTP, and finishing such a single 5min interval, I'm completely dead.

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Tapeworm
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by Tapeworm

^ the repeatability of intervals and their relative intensity is hard to work out exaclty but generally if trying hit the 3x3mims "correctly" the first should leave you feeling like death warmed up. The last - you should be falling off the bike and looking at breakfast (again). Anything less than this means you aren't going hard enough.

As you correctly state a 5 min interval can wipe you out, ANY interval can trash you completely - but only if you put in the effort. If its too easy then go harder.
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KWalker
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by KWalker

I think there is some confusion between the intensity levels people are using.

Yah, I do 3x3s that leave me feeling like death, but they sure as shit ain't for vo2 max improvement and they aren't at 138% like one of the posters above. I don't think I've ever done a vo2 max interval above 120% even though I technically could.

IMO and from what I've gathered from others, a true interval at vo2 max shouldn't feel like much until oxygen debt accumulates around minute 2-3. Then it should sort of feel like you simply can't breathe as fast/hard as your legs can move. A max effort interval at that duration is different.
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jaketim114
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by jaketim114

^^^

What they said. After a 3 minute VO2 max interval, you should have trouble pedaling your bike for a little while. this 115-120% ftp is crap. I do VO2 max intervals around at least 150% FTP, for reference.

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Tinea Pedis
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by Tinea Pedis

KWalker wrote:Yah, I do 3x3s that leave me feeling like death, but they sure as shit ain't for vo2 max improvement

Mine are.

Seem to do the trick in pushing my 20min up.


Maybe it's just me.

KWalker
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by KWalker

Is the 20min. MMP a goal or side effect?

150% of FTP is not vo2 max power. True power at vo2 max is within the L5 zone for most athletes. People are just confusing terms really. You can do 3 or 5 min intervals above your vo2 max power, but then you're training different energy systems and creating different types of adaptations. Again, I think people confuse what vo2 max actually is versus just doing really hard intervals for under 5 min.
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Tapeworm
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by Tapeworm

The use of the terms are somewhat arbitarry, there isn't a clear delineation between energy systems. Even in a "pure" anaerobic intervals the aerobic system is still working. What does matter are the adaptations gained from said intervals. And if 3min intervals help drive up 20min power which helps drive FTP then the specifics of whether the interval is a vo2 or threshold or .... is moot. What has been found so far is that a variety of hard intervals as described do exactly this.
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jaketim114
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by jaketim114

^^^

What this guy said.

KWalker
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by KWalker

The goal of vo2 max intervals is to incur oxygen debt at around 100% of pvo2 max. Going far over this and you're likely to incur fatigue from other energy systems factors. They won't really raise the maximal aerobic ceiling as much because the time actually spent at the proper level to incur oxygen debt without being too anaerobic its pretty significant. All I'm saying if that the ONLY goal is to improve pvo2 max then I would work at a power close to that max. If pvo2 max is a peripheral adaptation or someone doesn't have much of a target then sure, go higher/harder/whatever
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