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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:50 pm 
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I am currently working on a training plan for this upcoming season(will start in mid April), and was taking ideas from Training and Racing with a Powermeter. I want overall improvement, will be riding both road races(60-100 km) and TT's(15-40 km), mostly flat/rolling hills, etc.

Until now I have done quite a bit FTP and VO2max intervals(2x20, 4x10, 5x5, 6x3 etc). I've always been taught that intervals in the anaerobic capacity/neuromuscular range should be left until 4-8 weeks before "peaking", but is this correct?

My thought is to include a bit of shorter intervals with higher intensity in my current training plan now, maybe on weekend rides that will last 2,5-4 hours, but also on the turbo.

What's your thought on these shorter/harder intervals?

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:17 pm 
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Answer is: it depends. What are your racing goals.

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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:17 pm 


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:37 am 
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Tapeworm wrote:
Answer is: it depends. What are your racing goals.

Being an overall better rider. TT will get special attention this season, but I'd still have my focus on the road races as these are maybe 80-90% of my race schedule. I want to improve overall fitness, with the ability to go in breakaways and still being fresh at the end. Makes more sense?

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:20 pm 
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Based on what you just said I don't see the role of said efforts. If you want to be a better overall rider I'd build your aerobic engine as long as possible. This will also help you be a better break rider and TT rider.

Also, work with your teammates or more experienced riders to figure out how to use your power. I have similar goals right now and a history of great power but not doing anything great with it so my goal is to build my motor and rely on advice from teammates on how/when to use it.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:50 pm 
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Kermithimself wrote:
with the ability to go in breakaways and still being fresh at the end

From someone whose main tactic is this, I can assure you if you're in the right break no one is ever 'fresh' at the end.

Only less spent than the others. Which is to say, just a little less likely to fall off your bike with exhaustion.


Build the engine, work on your TT's. The physiological side of the break aways will take care of itself, the race craft side of it will be up to you to learn.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:52 am 
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Cool. Very nice with the feedback :) One of my thoughts was that when we want to peak we do a lot of these short intervals to get the last ooomph. So if I was to train regularly with FTP and VO2max in focus my progress in my FTP would look something like this(FTP value is what my FTP would be in the beginning of the training week)

Week 1: FTP = 300 watts
Week 2: FTP = 305 watts
Week 3: FTP = 310 watts
Week 4: FTP = 315 watts - easy week
Week 5: FTP = 310 watts
Week 6: FTP = 315 watts
Week 7: FTP = 320 watts
Week 8: FTP = 325 watts - easy week
Week 9: FTP = 320 watts
Etc

Note that this is a completely hypothetical example.

Now, as far as I know(correct me if I'm wrong), our Functional Threshold Power is affected by different training methods. You can not increase your FTP simply by doing 30 second intervals, but my I'm guessing that you can use them to boost your FTP towards a peak. A timetrial for instance is rarely done only in your FTP zone, but will have some points where the effort is a lot higher than FTP. My own experience is that my overall fitness increases when I get close to my peak. Both my VO2max values as well as my FTP. So my thought was to incorporate the shorter intervals in my training to give a boost in my FTP. A training routine could look something like thise

Week 1: FTP = 300 watts. Focus on FTP and VO2max intervals
Week 2: FTP = 305 watts. Focus on FTP and VO2max intervals
Week 3: FTP = 310 watts. Focus on anaerobic capacity/neuromuscular
Week 4: FTP = 320 watts. Easy week
Week 5: FTP = 315 watts. Focus on FTP and VO2max intervals
Week 6: FTP = 320 watts. Focus on FTP and VO2max intervals
Week 6: FTP = 325 watts. Focus on anaerobic capacity/neuromuscular
Week 7: FTP = 335 watts. Easy week
Week 8: FTP = 330 watts. Focus on FTP and VO2max intervals
Etc

Now is this completely nonsense? It was just a thought I had :D

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Last edited by Kermithimself on Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:13 am 
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If by 'restitution' you mean 'rest', not sure why you're following the 3 on, 1 off periods again?

As you've been over this before.


Sure, there are times in a TT when you have to give it more of a kick. But from my experience the less you go in to z6 and 7 (basically the smoother you can measure your power output) then the better your ride will be.


That's not to say some anaerobic work won't help FTP. That's another debate (and not one I think 30s intervals will contribute a whole heap to).



As an aside, this is also totally OT from your original question. Shall I combine these in to one thread for you? As that might help ;)

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:24 am 
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The restitution is basically an easy week - just called it restitution in lack of better words :)

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:43 am 
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To echo TP, why a restuition week? Seems like a waste of a week.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:58 am 
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Tapeworm wrote:
To echo TP, why a restuition week? Seems like a waste of a week.

Noted. Changed to an "easy" week.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:34 pm 
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Why an easy week then?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:08 pm 
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Tapeworm wrote:
Why an easy week then?

Good question. From what I've been told you need to have "breaks" in your training to let your fitness catch up/fully restitute. If not correct, please let me know :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:32 pm 
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2 easy days might do it, a full week? Bah, as said, waste of valuable training time

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:54 pm 
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Alright, makes it quite easier to plan :D

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:47 pm 
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Tapeworm wrote:
Why an easy week then?

I and most of my athletes do very well with an easier week, but maybe my definition of it is different than others.

Usually its something like:

1 or 2 days off at the start of the week.
2 days with work in L2 with some very short L7 efforts of 15s or less
Another day off or spin
Depending on the person we would then do openers for a 3, 5, and 20min max test, or just the tests (I use the monod sheet and this makes it a lot more accurate).
Last ride of the generally speaking (since I tend to only work with road racers) is an easier L2 ride.

The week ends up being about 1/2-2/3 of the peak TSS from the last block. All of these people (with one exception) tend to ride at a decently high volume of 12-20hrs/week depending on the period and frequency differs. Sometimes its been every 3rd week, sometimes not for 8 weeks. I've found that the supercompensation effect to be really profound and it offers many a mental break as well. During their blocks they rarely take more than 1 day off at a time and most tend to do recovery rides on those days if they see fit. Every single one has put up personal best results and power records doing this so I see no compelling reason to change.

When I used the block method in weightlifting and to train MMA fighters we did the same thing to transition between blocks and it had the same positive benefits.

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Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:47 pm 


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