Lightest KinLin XR-300 Build

[GrahamB]

Are they SILS nipples? Did you replace the nipples when you used new spokes?

They're Sapim polyax, sorry, I forget what are SILS now. Yes, replaced them all.
Twice in fact: replaced all the nipples on the original spokes, went from 10mm to 12mm.
Then the longer spokes came with new nipples, so a different batch (and colour, old ones were black, new ones silver). I also de-burred all the spoke holes with a drill bit and put copper-based grease on the seating part of the nipple at installation.

At least I can keep track, there are now two black nipples among the silver.

The spokes themselves seem indestructible... I twisted one of the old ones 90° while trying to remove a loctited nipple, re-installed with a new nipple and it was still fine when I swapped the spokes months later.

[djconnel]

The spoke count and spoke tension are not related in any way - a high-spoke count wheel can have high tension, and visa-versa. Spoke tension only needs to be high enough to stop the spokes going slack under a load which 'compresses' the spokes on one side of the wheel. The 'correct' spoke tension for a wheel is determined by the hub's flange geometry and lacing pattern, not the spoke count....

A lower spoke count does mean that under load (such as an impact) there will be more load per spoke but not spoke tension

The change in tension of a spoke is proportional to the ratio of the load from the bike + rider to the number of spokes supporting that load. The spokes in the wheel need to support that load without going slack. Since the load per spoke is greater the smaller the number of spokes for a given lacing pattern, they need to be biased to a greater tension to avoid going slack. On the other hand, they also need to be tensioned low enough that they don't reach their upper limit in supporting the same load (a load is supported by half the spokes becoming tenser, half less tense). So the upper limit on tension is lower for fewer spokes.

Sure, if you tend to tension mid-way between the two limits, spoke count doesn't matter. But the range of allowed tensions is compressed with fewer spokes.

[Tristan]

The change in tension of a spoke is proportional to the ratio of the load from the bike + rider to the number of spokes supporting that load. The spokes in the wheel need to support that load without going slack. Since the load per spoke is greater the smaller the number of spokes for a given lacing pattern, they need to be biased to a greater tension to avoid going slack. On the other hand, they also need to be tensioned low enough that they don't reach their upper limit in supporting the same load (a load is supported by half the spokes becoming tenser, half less tense). So the upper limit on tension is lower for fewer spokes.

Sure, if you tend to tension mid-way between the two limits, spoke count doesn't matter. But the range of allowed tensions is compressed with fewer spokes.

Generally a low spoke-count wheel has a much stiffer rim. I agree with what you're saying but I think this could only happen if the rim / wheel is nowhere close to being stiff enough for the rider??

[djconnel]

This topic, I thought, was about the Kinlin XR-300.... so we're comparing the same rim with a different spoke count. More spokes means you can get away with lower spoke tension, or with higher spoke tension, then with fewer spokes, until the spoke count gets low enough that for a given load (which depends on rider weight, but also on riding style) the minimum is greater than the maximum...

Then there's the condition of the rim, as a bent rim requires nonuniform spoke tension to keep it true, further eating into the margin between minimum and maximum tension.

An additional factor is if you break a spoke, then how badly does the wheel fail. 32 spokes: generally retrue and ride home. 16 spokes....