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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2003 11:01 pm 
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Location: Germany
spytech wrote:
One question, Do the ZIPP Z3 have hybrid brearings or Full ceramic bearings? because if its only hybrid, then it would not justify the big price difference, right?

http://www.zipp.com/HubsBearings/index.html

When I read through their descriptions they're "just" high precision steel bearings with a special grease.

edit:
I was on the site for the ZIPP 84/202 hubs :oops:
I'd say the Z3 have hybrid bearings.
http://www.zipp.com/HubsBearings/z_series.html
Quote:
The bearing races themselves are a hybrid ceramic specific alloy finely ground and polished


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 5:56 am 
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I guess i will be keeping my bearings.

and i was thinking of some type of performance increase. :roll:


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Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 5:56 am 


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 18, 2004 10:13 pm 
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Location: Santa Monica, CA
The thought of hybrid ceramic bearings interests me. I was told that more manufacturers are starting to use them in hubs, but no names. Has anyone tried the Z-series Zipp hubs and can comment about the bearing life and smoothness?

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 19, 2004 5:52 am 
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acros headsets are available with ceramic-hybrids - just if someone wanted to know :)


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 19, 2004 5:58 am 
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btw 222€ and - as i was told by some guy from acros - you get one separate bearing additionally to those pressed into the headsetcups


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 19, 2004 12:02 pm 
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Well, I have put SiNi ceramic balls in 6 or 7 Campy Eurus Wheels. I´ll be dammed if any of my customers would state that they can´t feel the difference!
They roll so much lighter, and the wear is decreased substantially!
You will need some special SKF grease, but the amuont of grease is very small (1/10th or 1/15th of the normally needed)
An other cool thing is that when the balls are installed, the Eurus sounds like a carbon tubular.
The price in Denmark is 85$ installed.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 19, 2004 12:20 pm 
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If I had some money at hand upgrading my bearing would be one of the performance improvements I'd make.
A lightweight seatpost has very performance impact.

Brian


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 20, 2004 5:28 pm 
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Excuse my ignorance here, but is there any point at all to using a ceramic bearing for a bicycle hub application?

Am I wrong in thinking that they are commonly used in applications such as electric motors, etc, where there is a very high rate of rpm? A bicycle hub would never get close to the sort of rpm's in these aforementioned applications, so it seems like a big waste of money and time.

If you are to use ceramic bearings, would it also make sense to use a ceramic bearing race? That way, you could virtually eliminate lubration of any kind altogether. Ceramic bearings do not suffer from the micro-welding issues like those seen with regular steel balls, so that would be an advantage. But again, I cannot see any worthwhile advantages for such a bearing when applied to the bicycle.

Anyone?


Last edited by BikeTech on Sun Jun 20, 2004 8:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 20, 2004 8:01 pm 
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Mario Jr. wrote:
I´ll be dammed if any of my customers would state that they can´t feel the difference!
They roll so much lighter ...

I consider that nonsense. Drag of bearings on a road bike should be equivalent to 0.1% of all forces the rider has to overcome. Funny how expensive material seems to suspend a clear mind ...

P.S.: A well lubed chain has a degree of efficiency of around 99%. Those roller links are stoneage technology compared to a regular ball bearing.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 20, 2004 8:34 pm 
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I think the good doctor's statement helped to highlight the point I was trying to make...


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 1:01 am 
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Wouldn't that depend on the quality of your existing bearings?

IMO Mavic make very good hubs, but they also make heavy wheels?
Who else makes good/light hubs?

Brian


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:13 am 
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Location: Mainhattan
I have a pair of Lightweight wheels with ceramics balls in them. I can not feel any difference whatsoever!!!! and I absolutely do not believe if others can feel the difference between a high quality steel ball and a ceramic one. The ceramics might make a bit more noise if used without grease.
A complete set of ceramic balls (for hub and freehub) makes the wheel 15-20 grams lighter though, but sets you back close to USD 200.
BTW: I also have a set of ceramics bearing in my TA Ixis Titanium bottom bracket where I can not feel the difference, but it is 9 grams lighter than a steel bearing.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 7:35 pm 
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Villadsen wrote:
I have a pair of Lightweight wheels with ceramics balls in them. I can not feel any difference whatsoever!!!! and I absolutely do not believe if others can feel the difference between a high quality steel ball and a ceramic one. The ceramics might make a bit more noise if used without grease.
A complete set of ceramic balls (for hub and freehub) makes the wheel 15-20 grams lighter though, but sets you back close to USD 200.
BTW: I also have a set of ceramics bearing in my TA Ixis Titanium bottom bracket where I can not feel the difference, but it is 9 grams lighter than a steel bearing.


is it full ceramic? not only the balls? i have heard that the difference comes from a full ceramic setup, and not just the balls.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 7:46 pm 
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It is only balls. Dont think that it matters much though because the balls alone would also prevent any cold welding. Full ceramic is too expencive for me.....


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 9:45 pm 
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what would be the cheapest full ceramic bearing setup? anyone see the prices coming down anytime soon?


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Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 9:45 pm 


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