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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:40 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:48 am
Posts: 24
Hi all

I have a 2015 model Mavic R-sys clincher (25m Conti GP with Michelin latex tubes) and a set of 2015 Bora One 50 tubulars (Conti Competition 25mm tires).

I just wanted to know if we compare these two wheels, how does the world of cycling theories apply to theses wheels in terms climbing?

I'm considering moving to a single wheelset - but living in Hong Kong there are lots of climbing - so I want to make sure I have a wheelset that is "top notch" for climbing.

On paper the Boras are slightly lighter and my seat of pants tends finds them much stiffer when out of the saddle compared to the R-sys.

Any thoughts from more experienced folks?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 10:50 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:48 am
Posts: 1469
Do the R-Sys have extra-thick spokes? If yes and if they are heavier than the Boras, the Mavics will be slower on climbs and on the flat because aero and weight


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 2:25 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:30 am
Posts: 455
Counterpoint: After climbing, do you descend? Does it rain a lot in HK? If so, the Mavics will brake better.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 2:32 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 11:43 pm
Posts: 630
Location: Florida
Additional consideration: The tubs will corner better and are safer descending should you get a flat at full speed.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 3:08 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 9:33 pm
Posts: 14
Any advice on what is the best aluminium clincher wheel for climbing ?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 6:46 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:48 am
Posts: 24
Thanks for your feedback guys.

Here's what I can fathom based on my real world experience with both wheels. And a few things where I am undecided.

R-SYS vs Bora One 50
- The R-sys are 20mm wide rims vs 24mm for the Bora. The Boras feel better in on-road handling in this regard.
- I prefer tubulars vs clinchers, although with latex the road feel is very close now.
- The all up system weight is almost even - Bora with rim tape and sealant.
- Aero - the Boras as much more aero. But on climbs - irrelevant.
- Stiffness - the Boras are much more laterally stiff.
- Braking - strangely, the R-SYS give me more confidence due to the alloy rim BUT the Bora seems to have more braking grip in the dry.

Now apart from the above, I am undecided on the following:
- Which "spins" easier, which is easier to get rolling and has the least rotational weight?
- Which will have the higher cadence for the same amount of effort/power? (I prefer high cadence, so a wheel that helps in this regard is preferable to me).
- The Boras are stiffer, but can a wheel be too stiff? Ie. is there any advantage to a wheel that has a little lateral flex (ie. the R-SYS)?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 6:57 am 
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Posts: 455
- Which "spins" easier, which is easier to get rolling and has the least rotational weight?

You won't notice any difference.

- Which will have the higher cadence for the same amount of effort/power? (I prefer high cadence, so a wheel that helps in this regard is preferable to me).

This question makes no sense.

- The Boras are stiffer, but can a wheel be too stiff? Ie. is there any advantage to a wheel that has a little lateral flex (ie. the R-SYS)?

Too stiff a wheel can cause it to rub on a not very stiff frame.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:12 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:48 am
Posts: 24
Thanks Kibbler.

On the second question - I'm struggling to write what I'm thinking... ;-)


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:55 am 
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Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:31 pm
Posts: 144
if you already have both sets of wheels then why don't you just ride to a few hills and do some real world testing. Then choose the ones that you like the most??


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2016 3:22 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:48 am
Posts: 24
Thanks guys,

I have tried them both obviously. As as I've stated in my previous message, I can find some differences. But there are a few that I can't seem to be clear on. And anecdotally, all the guys here are raving on about the RSYS and prefering climbing wheels, which is screwing with my mind because I "SEEM" to think the Boras climb better.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:09 am 
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Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2010 6:54 am
Posts: 39
Location: Europe
You write that aero is irrelevant when climbing, but that is not true. If the Boras are lighter and more aero, it makes sense that they climb better.

_________________
http://danishphotos.com


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2016 9:10 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 7:45 pm
Posts: 3998
Location: Natovi Landing
nibby wrote:
if you already have both sets of wheels then why don't you just ride to a few hills and do some real world testing. Then choose the ones that you like the most??


LOL - some sanity !

_________________
----------------------------------------
Stiff, Light, Aero - Pick Three!! :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2016 9:22 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:48 am
Posts: 24
Heres what I can gather on the weights for both wheels:

R-SYS (FR 555grams/RW740) = 1295 grams
Michelin Latex = 70grams.x2
Conti 25 GP4000 = 225gx2
Total weight 2025 grams.

Bora ONE 50 Tubs
Bora One 545/720 = 1265 grams
Conti Competitions 25mm = 270gramsx2
=1805 grams

So 220 grams lighter but after adding rim tape (**20gram x2) and sealant (**40gram x2) - then I think almost even - but Bora wins by 100grams net.

** = guesstimate.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2016 10:23 am 
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Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:31 pm
Posts: 144
Ok so which go faster up the same hill??

That might be your answer :)


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2016 12:39 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:31 am
Posts: 134
The Boras will have considerably lighter rims, so if you buy the rotational mass theory, they'll make better climbing wheels. Tubs are safer than clinchers for descending and give a better ride. Both wheels will brake well in the dry. The Boras will be a bit faster on descents as they are aero (but the drag effect is tiny in comparison to the impact of the rider).

The R-SYS might be easier to live with if you're not a routine user of tubulars. They'll stop much better in the wet. You risk blowing tubes if you're a very cautious descender (i.e. drag the brakes) but Exalith handles heat better than plain alloy. They'll have better cross-wind stability, which might be a factor for you on sketchy descents if it's windy.

I generally travel with two wheelsets - either Enve 45s (very similar to your Boras) or AX Lightness Ultra 24 (carbon tubs, much lighter than either of your sets) and R-SYS SLR tubs. I'll take the Enves if the terrain is mixed, the AX Lightness for big mountains and use the R-SYS if there's any chance of rain or bad weather. If I absolutely had to choose only one wheelset, it would be the R-SYS for wet weather braking capability...BUT all my sets are tubular, so it's not a straight comparison to your situation.


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