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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:43 am 
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Joined: Sun Nov 10, 2002 6:03 pm
Posts: 309
Location: Belfast
As predicted this one has stirred up the proverbial hornets nest. To me a true weight weenie is someone - no matter what arguments are made about ultra light bikes - who will put their money where their dreams are and who makes the sacrifices to build a very light bike, regardless if it is to be raced or not, and regardless if they themselves ride it or not. I think "lightbikism" is brought into the realms of stupidity when safety, performance (not a noodle) and reasonable longevity (not a noodle after one outing) are compromised, I mean if this was brought to its logical conclusion what is there to stop someone building a 0.5kg bike from paper and drinks cans!! This reminds me of a rowing boat that the russians or East Germans built in the 70's which was designed to fall apart as it went down the course, and it would disintergrate as it crossed the line! Needless to say FISA (world rowing federation) banned it. No doubt I'll get lambasted as a luddite but it'll be interesting to follow the thread.


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Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:43 am 


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 Post subject: Great thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 1:19 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2002 4:49 am
Posts: 1902
Gandini, I think it is a great thread you have started.

I have to mainly agree with your sentiments, and I suspect 2002SR has misinterpreted your comments re:Superlite.

In my experence a true WW is not always the one on the lightest bike, but the one who show a great understanding of the available products and selects those that suit their requirements best. In this case a weight is a high priority in the selection process, but not at a cost to their cycling experence.

For myself I have ridden parts that are too flexy for my liking, and I don't like having too call to have someone pick me up after a part failure, but my new bike has to comply with the UCI. So I am investigating to two posibilites with the build: a bike as light as I can build with high stiffness and add weight to get it up to the minium limit, or build it with heavier parts and just come to the limit with "inferiour" parts.

Now this is the true racing WW dilemia.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 1:59 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:33 pm
Posts: 200
Hi guys! I'm new here and from Singapore. :D

I have a fat Scotts CR1 '04 at 14.8 lbs but wish to shed another 1-2 lbs later on.

Point is, I want to be a weight-weenie without sacrificing practicality and safety with idealism.

My point being that along the course of shedding weight, there will come a certain point wherein the bike can't be ridden at all and would just end up as a conversational piece.

My take on the matter on being a true weight-weenie, one must still be able to use the bike, make it practical and safe. ...and can still be actually used for impromptu races or distance travels.

I've had bad days when cross-winds and small road defects become hazardous with a light set-up. And I'm just talking about a sub 15 lbs bike.

So where will that shedding point stop when practicality becomes nil?

I've started off as an active roadie and got bitten by the weenie bug when I got my CR1. But it would be sad to see the bike become inactive due to too much wieght loss and jsut become a famous topic to be admiringly discussed.

Anyway thats my take....what weight I will stop, remains still to be seen... there must be a compromise weight . :)


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 2:03 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 1:59 am
Posts: 1386
Location: Sydney, Australia
Personally I'm a techno weenie who aims for the best performance available. (I suspect alot of members are).

weight-weenie n. a MTB owner (not even necessarily a rider) who is more concerned with how many milligrams a certain component saves off the bike's total weight than with how to be a better rider.

techno-weenie n. a rider who knows more about the newest MTB parts and techno-fads than about the trails. Someone who buys lots of gadgets to add supposed iotas of performance to the bike. Greeting a friend whom we haven't seen in a year, I might say "Hi, Marta!" A techno-weenie might say "Oooh, you got White Industries hubs on that bike now?"

My bike might be just over the UCI limit, but it's also the most functional bike in my area. (Still deciding on Cosmics, Zipps or other wheels, but the 420's will be climbing wheels unless I buy a lighter deep section pair)


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 4:24 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 9:28 pm
Posts: 1769
Location: Unknown parameter
Forget about a true weight weenie, what kind of "true" cyclist grabs for the cell phone over a flat tubular? Ride that baby home!

I tried to ride home with a broken pelvis last summer and only went for the cell phone when a second flat made me stop and allowed things to seize up some more. Naturally the cell didn't work where I was so I rode another 10km on 2 flats only to find nobody home when I called. Eventually made it to a place with more traffic and hitched a ride home. Now I am back to not taking the cell phone. Didn't need one for the first 20 years and when I did it didn't work. Saves me 121.6g leaving it at home.

Also if you are calling your wife to drop everything and come get you with a flat, and I assume people do it more than once, do you really think that won't be held against you for the rest of your life?????? Dream on!


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 4:25 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 10:56 pm
Posts: 3722
Location: Wichita, KS
Being a ww means different things to different people.

For me the parts I fit my bike with are often a function of the money that I have (or money available on my credit card...Ha Ha). You gotta have the cha-ching before you get the bling. So I end up making compromises to save money. I've got to have quality for my money though. I'm not going to spend a dime on something that's going to snap in two upon installation.

I shop ebay a lot looking for bargains. For example the Rolf Prima Vigor's that I bought brand new for $575, the FSA Superlight crank I got for $225, the DA 7800 shifters I got for half of retail, etc. I try to build up a quality ride for as low a price as I can. Believe me, I've ditched a lot of work searching for bike parts on ebay.

I also have to get components that are tailored to my type of riding. All the while I keep weight in mind but I have to consider that super light weight climbing wheels don't suit me when I spend about 85% of my rides on flats and rolling hills. I can't go tubular because it doesn't seem to support my amature recreational riding lifestyle.

So am I a true WW?....maybe not ....but that doesn't stop me from searching for Lighter, affordable, solid components for my bike to help me improve my performance.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 4:44 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 6:05 am
Posts: 1011
drjones96 wrote:
Being a ww means different things to different people.



:exactly:

I just think there's different levels and approaches to WWism. We got this guy here, for example: http://www.utsidan.se/ddb/lashorna/visa/658.htm
:lol: Complete nutcase! But I'll almost respect his approach in principle at least. And the hospitals might need income so they're probably for it also. :)

It's very easy to get a bike down to 6.8kg. But taking another kg off is where the bling bling comes in, so the other approach is speding $$ for good light parts, IMO. It just a matter of how much and how reliable you want your bike.

Personally, I have a 5.8kg TCR (need to update my listing btw) which is as durable and rideable as any bike much heavier .. so that's the route I like going. I don't want to change the tires every 100k or the cassette every 1000k!


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:15 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2002 7:41 pm
Posts: 356
Location: New Mexico USA
I was reminded of the old saying about econmists: they know the price of everything, but the value of nothing. Perhaps a true weight weenie knows the weight of everything, but the strength of nothing?
btw, Bobalou, I'd like to see the specs of your 5.8Kg TCR...as you know, I'm a believer in that frame!

cheers,

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:18 pm 
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Location: Colorado
Quote:
I was reminded of the old saying about econmists: they know the price of everything, but the value of nothing. Perhaps a true weight weenie knows the weight of everything, but the strength of nothing?


If thats the case then a true weight weenie is an idiot. :lol:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:37 pm 
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gandini wrote:
I was reminded of the old saying about econmists: they know the price of everything, but the value of nothing. Perhaps a true weight weenie knows the weight of everything, but the strength of nothing?


I agree with superlite because basically the "true weightweenie" could be defined as the guy above that drilled all the holes in his bike. There's no way he knows how strong (weak actually :lol:) it is. That guy IS an idiot!

In my thinking, Mr hole-in-the-bike is a WW .. but a true weight weenie should know:
<b>
- weight
- price (value)
- strength
</b>
of all his compontents.

If someone is just going for a "world record" bike then maybe that's a different story as it's intended purpose does not include riding it much or at all.
Quote:

btw, Bobalou, I'd like to see the specs of your 5.8Kg TCR...as you know, I'm a believer in that frame!

cheers,


I'll do that soon, have to snap some photo's .. etc


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:48 pm 
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Location: Colorado
Quote:
Bobalou wrote
In my thinking, Mr hole-in-the-bike is a WW .. but a true weight weenie should know:

- weight
- price (value)
- strength

of all his compontents.


YES!!!! That is exactly what a true weight weenie is. Thank you. :beerchug:

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 11:55 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 10:56 pm
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Location: Wichita, KS
I think it was Bontrager that said "Strong, Light, Cheap.... Pick Two"

I think about 14 pounds (real weight) is about as low a weight as a sensible bike could be (all the obvious things considered, 9-10 spd, 700C etc). Go very far below that and you're looking at wheels and frames that are kinda shady in terms of strength and durability. What good is a bike you can't ride under normal cercumstances?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 3:15 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2002 7:41 pm
Posts: 356
Location: New Mexico USA
I'll accept that a weight weenie bike should be rideable--and not just to the end of the driveway and back! However, my commute is quite "normal" riding conditions: New Mexico city roads where over 50% of vehicles are pickup trucks or SUVs, where the City and State budgets are spent on prisons and grazing subsidies not roads or bike paths, where puncture vine is considered ground cover, where public officials convicted of drunk driving are re-elected, where stop signs and indicator lights/turn signals are optional. I do this twice a day, 5 days a week for 90 minutes. On a 5.8Kg bike. I haven't seen the upside of 14lbs in months, almost a year. OK, I don't race, but if I did I'd be riding a UCI legal bike anyway.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 3:26 am 
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We have 1760 registered users

...and probably 1760 opinions. Long live diversity. :D

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 4:02 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 3:56 am
Posts: 21
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Exactly. 1760 opinions, but we do all have one thing in common. The dedication, research and passion that goes into what components we buy to build or improve our bikes. The joy or occasionally disappointment when it works well (or doesn't). The enjoyment I get from my bikes is more than from the riding. It is from the effort that went in the decisions in the first place.


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 Post subject:
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 4:02 am 


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