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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 4:33 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2004 1:44 am
Posts: 640
Location: Boulder, CO
I am always shocked at how excited people get about a news posting about a new bike. yippee. So they've managed to improve it, great, good for them. I always laugh how excited people get over a product posting (regardless of subject, be it bikes, music gear, cars, etc).

My friend just switched from his Giant to a Trek (courtesy of being on a Trek Regional team) and has yet to say the Trek is a better bike than his older Giant. Actually, he did say that the Bontrager wheels seem faster than his old Ksyriums ;)

BTW, Trek had a huge surge in their sales when Lance won the Tour. Go check the numbers. Go talk to anyone at the company BESIDES a sales rep. Before Lance brought them up the podium, they were NOT held in very good regard as a top quality racing bike.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:25 pm 
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Location: Detroit-USA
Maybe the quality of the paint work has declined but my 2000 5500 has perfect paint. Quality of the bike/ride can either be connected to finish or not. I am sure superlite would agree, because his belove C-dale have what I consider to be the most bombastic welding I have ever seen. I looked just the other day at the 6-13 frames and saw what i have always seen from C-dale- sloppy welding..... always have always will be.... But then old steel Colnagos were sort of sloppy also. Same with Bianchi..... but as we all know sloppy in the finish department does not necesarily equate to poor ride or strength issues.
Just my opinion, but I dont understand why S-lite was so excited about his initial post......Lance's new bike truly looks like the same old bike...... and Trek keeps putting out new stuff, only to replace it a year later.....I am sort of trouble by that sort of marketing......


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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:25 pm 


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:49 pm 
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Well it's a pretty big evolution from the last bike, they've gotta catch up with Scott 'n Giant in the weight stakes.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:09 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 7:13 am
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Location: Finland
I will be fun to see what next Tour-mag gets out of new Giant. Old Madone was something I newer would buy. SL may me be better. I had 120 OCLV for 3 years but It started to feel too soft.

There are amoust more carbon than alloy TCR's in my friends. Most are build old alloy ones to TT-bikes,mainly "fast" fork. Also Bianchi Carbon's are coming popular. And all TIME models. They will be my choice for carbon frame, or Look 461 for low €'s. Hobby riders are getting Tommasini Fire's, great steel ride! No more Colnago's here. Tommasini seem to take it's place. Look has well balanced feel and great price.

Ok, I'll understand that this forum in weight weenie forum but I still would first take care that frame in right size, stiff enought and desent to ride before weight. Same goes for training,here is forum for it but nobody seem to use it. To count these two up, are anybydy really riding these bikes? Ok, is these anywhere better forum for training?

We build one 2003' M-size Giant and it was 1060g...light, sure. But 110 OCLV like 5900SL is not very far?

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Last edited by Samu Ilonen on Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:15 pm 
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That's nonsense. Cannondale welding has large smooth transitions. It's indeed different looking compared to most other manufacturers I can think of and certainly not rough with blobs and bumps like Bianchi.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:19 pm 
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I would say just same. They are weldet with very different ideology in mind.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:26 pm 
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Location: Colorado
Quote:
We build one 2003' M-size Giant and it was 1060g...light, sure. But 110 OCLV like 5900SL is not very far?


The new Madone SSL is right around 900g.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 8:51 pm 
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Location: Detroit-USA
Maybe youguys get better ones than we do in the Midwest- but NO ONE (not even s'lite) is going to tell me that C'dale welds are smooth- they are so "bad" that they have to be "smoothed out". It is one thing to say that they are fast or win races or that they are affordable, etc. But the fabrication techniques are not about the craft of welding. Now you may say that it doe not matter and then I would agree with you. As written about extensively, go look at a Moots for Ti craft, a Serotta for steel craft and ? for carbon craft- and definately not c'dale for alum craft.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:10 pm 
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Location: Colorado
Quote:
but NO ONE (not even s'lite) is going to tell me that C'dale welds are smooth


I'll post some pics of my bike later, then tell me how "bad" the welds are.

Maybe on the older CAAD 4's and such, but the CAAD 7 has a great welding job.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:46 pm 
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Location: Detroit-USA
S-lite: "bad" welds were personally witnessed by me (no second hand info here) on a 6-13 that I inspected two weeks ago. By "bad" I mean, not flowing in a nearly perfect radius. A really perfect fillet welded steel bike (Which I owned and was custom made by a now defunct frame builder "Mark Zeh") is what I have in mind. Similar to the monocoque look of a Trek carbon- where one tube disappears into the next without any abrubt transitions. But to produce this is really time consuming and perhaps not capable of being done with aluminum. Are there any "gorgeous" aluminum frames? Let me know....
PS- these flowing lines require extra weld material and therefore produce a heavier frame......not exactly what a WW would be looking for.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 10:26 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 5:18 pm
Posts: 731
Location: Austin
you will never see a c'dale weld because they grind them away. they use a dynafile to file smooth all their welds.

if you did see a raw c'dale weld, you would puke. the use mig welders and pile up multi pass turkey poop knowing they will grind and paint.

it works and that all that matters.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 11:08 pm 
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Location: Detroit-USA
nicrump wrote:
you will never see a c'dale weld because they grind them away. they use a dynafile to file smooth all their welds.

If you grind the weld away, the tubes would collapse- they grind as much as they can in as little time as is allowed by the bean counters.....

it works and that all that matters.


The people on this site are concerned with more than whether something "works" or not...... The debris in Trek paint jobs is just the most recent example.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 11:18 pm 
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Location: Colorado
Here is the finished weld, looks very nice to me.

This thread is a waste, it was supposed to be on the new Madone SSL, not on cannondale welds, or paint jobs!

Someone close this.


Attachments:
Headtube.jpg
Headtube.jpg [ 104.86 KiB | Viewed 529 times ]
Seattube.jpg
Seattube.jpg [ 88.69 KiB | Viewed 525 times ]

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 11:28 pm 
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C-40, that's just laughable. Anyone who has $2K+ to spend on a frame set is looking for more than just function. To think or even assume any different is a display of poor reasoning.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 11:40 pm 
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Superlite, you need some of these instead of in-line cable adjusters.

BTW, my whole frame sort of looks dynafiled :)


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cablestop.jpg [ 111.98 KiB | Viewed 572 times ]
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 11:40 pm 


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