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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 9:27 am 
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Posts: 244
mpulsiv wrote:
That's what I said! Not only it's expensive but you don't support your LBS by dealing with direct sales from Canyon.


I agree I think it is too expensive for what it is offering (limited selection, no option to customize...)

Nonetheless, I believe Canyon is doing the same thing as Lightweight, Sidi, and others are doing; have a regional exclusive distributor. The distributors jack up the prices for the US. That simple, Proof? Compare the prices from Eur online retailers (even after paying import taxes.)

At these price points, i'd much rather buy another bike band from th LBS...)


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Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 9:27 am 


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 7:28 am 
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When was the last ultimate released and the one before that?

I'm trying to gauge when the next one might come and and hopefully with direct mount brakes


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 1:31 pm 
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden
hanakuso1 wrote:
When was the last ultimate released and the one before that?

I'm trying to gauge when the next one might come and and hopefully with direct mount brakes

The current rim brake Ultimate was released 2016, the previous version 2012.

The new Aeroad arrived the year before 2015, the very first one 2011 I believe.

Not sure why you'd expect the next Ultimate to have direct mount brakes. If Canyon saw any benefit to putting direct mount brakes on the Ultimate, I am sure they would've done it already considering the Aeroad has them.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 5:15 pm 
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MayhemSWE wrote:
hanakuso1 wrote:
When was the last ultimate released and the one before that?

I'm trying to gauge when the next one might come and and hopefully with direct mount brakes

The current rim brake Ultimate was released 2016, the previous version 2012.

The new Aeroad arrived the year before 2015, the very first one 2011 I believe.

Not sure why you'd expect the next Ultimate to have direct mount brakes. If Canyon saw any benefit to putting direct mount brakes on the Ultimate, I am sure they would've done it already considering the Aeroad has them.

I wasn't aware the Aeroad came out before the Ultimate. I was hoping they were going in the Direct mount direction with newer bikes.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 2:17 am 
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Posts: 19
Just judging by peoples post on Instagram, it looks like people are getting there orders fulfilled. Even the CEO of Instagram has one already. Then again i'm guessing some of them are well connected.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 3:01 am 
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Posts: 10
mpulsiv wrote:
check6 wrote:
One thing I notice is the legacy brands here in the USA always come with mixed group-sets. At over $10,000 for a Tarmac SL, I don't want their cranks/chainset or Roval wheels. At least Canyon seems to have and advantage in this regard. Even the Giant TCR disc SRAM Etap comes with crappy proprietary wheels.


What crappy proprietary wheels are you talking about? http://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/tcr-ad ... -etap-2018

Image



Those wheels you have in the picture are made by Giant. While I'm sure they are fine, for less money on the Canyon I'd take the Mavics or DT Swiss...but thats just my preference.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 6:13 am 
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+1

I would also prefer to have the choice of wheels from Mavic, DT Swiss, Zipp, Fulcrum, etc...rather than from the bike manufacturer (maybe except for the Roval which used to be a very good company; much like Corima years ago)


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 7:06 am 
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Posts: 296
I guess they think it's easier to drop prices than raise prices. I wouldn't buy at that price.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:14 pm 
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TonyM wrote:
+1

I would also prefer to have the choice of wheels from Mavic, DT Swiss, Zipp, Fulcrum, etc...rather than from the bike manufacturer (maybe except for the Roval which used to be a very good company; much like Corima years ago)


Last time I checked, Giant wheels perform pretty damn close to Zipp 404. In contrast Fuji stock wheels performed poorly.

Image

Just saying...

Image

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:17 pm 
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Location: Loveland, CO
So here's a dumb question. Can you customize the cassette and chainring sizes on a Canyon? What do people do when they buy a bike and half of the components are not what they wanted? Do they just sell them on eBay and take the loss?

I haven't bought a full bike in a long while. I usually buy a frameset and build up the bike to the specs. that I like. I like Canyon bikes but not their standard component configurations.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:39 pm 
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Posts: 296
Location: Seattle, WA
pdlpsher1 wrote:
What do people do when they buy a bike and half of the components are not what they wanted? Do they just sell them on eBay and take the loss?

I haven't bought a full bike in a long while. I usually buy a frameset and build up the bike to the specs. that I like. I like Canyon bikes but not their standard component configurations.


Yes, but usually getting the whole bike build is a better "deal" -- cheaper than buying the frameset and the same parts separately. I went through this dilemma just recently. You'll notice that in most instances frameset MSRPs are quite high compared to the full-bike build with this regard ie. an Orbea Orca Aero sold at the lowest quality build (105) is ~$3300 yet the frameset sold by itself is $3000. The wheelset being included in that build sell for around $300 by themselves, so it's a better deal to just get the whole build and then bin/sell the rest. You would be comparatively "eating the cost" for an unreasonably high upcharge if you just buy the frameset itself.

On the other hand, other manufacturers will only sell the bike with a full spec, so in order to get the frame you want, you are forced to buy the whole bike and then bin/sell the rest. This is a problem at the high end if the manufacture isn't offering a build with cheap components like 105 because the $300 difference in that example is more like $3000+. In my case, the BMC SLR01 in white was only sold full build with eTap.. I already have parts I want to put on it and a several thousand dollar swing puts it out of my price range. I was lucky enough to find a dealer who would take off the build and just sell me the frameset as the same MSRP as the other frameset-exclusive SLR01s.

In a perfect world, manufacturers would only sell framesets to resellers which then spec the bike out for the end-user, but everyone involved wouldn't get whatever sale margin/partner discount/rebate/etc that makes it profitable for them to sell everything as they currently do.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:56 pm 
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Location: Loveland, CO
bilwit wrote:
pdlpsher1 wrote:
What do people do when they buy a bike and half of the components are not what they wanted? Do they just sell them on eBay and take the loss?

I haven't bought a full bike in a long while. I usually buy a frameset and build up the bike to the specs. that I like. I like Canyon bikes but not their standard component configurations.


Yes, but usually getting the whole bike build is a better "deal" -- cheaper than buying the frameset and the same parts separately. You'll notice that in most instances frameset MSRPs are quite high compared to the full-bike build with this regard ie. an Orbea Orca Aero sold at the lowest quality build (105) is ~$3300 yet the frame sold by itself is $3000. The wheelset being included in that build sell for around $300 by themselves, so it's a better deal to just get the whole build and then bin/sell the rest. You would be comparatively "eating the cost" for an unreasonably high upcharge if you just buy the frameset itself.


I'm not sure if your comparison is valid. I'm not sure on the Orbea but most framesets use the highest grade carbon and hence are lighter. Lowest priced full bikes use a lower grade of carbon on the frames. So you really can't compare a $3000 frameset to a $3300 full bike with 105 build if the frame/fork are actually different. When you look at the higher-end full bikes built with Shimano 9150 Di2 the MSRP doesn't see to justify the upgraded components. If one is wishing for 9150 Di2 it seems far cheaper to buy a frameset.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:08 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2016 5:49 am
Posts: 296
Location: Seattle, WA
pdlpsher1 wrote:
bilwit wrote:
pdlpsher1 wrote:
What do people do when they buy a bike and half of the components are not what they wanted? Do they just sell them on eBay and take the loss?

I haven't bought a full bike in a long while. I usually buy a frameset and build up the bike to the specs. that I like. I like Canyon bikes but not their standard component configurations.


Yes, but usually getting the whole bike build is a better "deal" -- cheaper than buying the frameset and the same parts separately. You'll notice that in most instances frameset MSRPs are quite high compared to the full-bike build with this regard ie. an Orbea Orca Aero sold at the lowest quality build (105) is ~$3300 yet the frame sold by itself is $3000. The wheelset being included in that build sell for around $300 by themselves, so it's a better deal to just get the whole build and then bin/sell the rest. You would be comparatively "eating the cost" for an unreasonably high upcharge if you just buy the frameset itself.


I'm not sure if your comparison is valid. I'm not sure on the Orbea but most framesets use the highest grade carbon and hence are lighter. Lowest priced full bikes use a lower grade of carbon on the frames. So you really can't compare a $3000 frameset to a $3300 full bike with 105 build if the frame/fork are actually different. When you look at the higher-end full bikes built with Shimano 9150 Di2 the MSRP doesn't see to justify the upgraded components. If one is wishing for 9150 Di2 it seems far cheaper to buy a frameset.


Yes, that is what the next paragraph addresses (I might have added it after you quoted). The same logic applies though, part-for-part, it is cheaper to buy the full build compared to each part individually, including the frameset. Of course, you may not need/want 90% of what's included (like in my situation), but comparatively, the frameset alone is charged at a higher price relative to what you pay for it in the full bike build. This obviously does not scale well when limited by the manufacturer-provided builds at the very high end, but still worth considering when mentioning "eating the cost" as the OP in that quote put it. You would be "eating the cost" of an upcharged frameset when buying it alone.

You are probably right about the new Orbea being unique in offering the same high end frame with cheap components. Like I said, it probably works out to be more profitable at the sales backend to sell high-end, full-build exclusive bikes which is why this is done this way more often than not. If you're looking for the whole build then it's a win for the consumer and everyone involved, if not, then it's a loss any way you put it with varying degree of significance.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:34 am 
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.....


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Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:34 am 


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:35 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:09 pm
Posts: 1102
Location: Loveland, CO
Bilwit,

Yes, it may be cheaper for buy the full build, but only if the components meet one's needs. If I have to part the components out on eBay and pay commission and depreciation, it might not make financial sense to buy a full bike.

More and more companies are now offering custom build programs. I've never used one but things like cassette ratios, handlebar width, and saddle are things I care a lot about. If I buy a new bike and I'm not comfortable on the saddle or handlebar, I will have a miserable experience no matter how much money I saved. It doesn't seem like Canyon has such a program. Maybe I'm just very different from everyone else. That's why I asked the question earlier about what do people do when they don't like the components the bike came with...


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