Torque wrenches - brand importance?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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BRM
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by BRM

Calnago wrote:Seriously though, you can never go wrong by getting the best tools you can afford. .


As hollow as can be . . . .

The rest of your text is about and around yourself. I see very little lines with the startpost.

:roll:

by Weenie


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Calnago
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by Calnago

Yup. I know. I just wanted to show you what I had.


C36
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by C36

evan326 wrote:
BRM wrote:I have 2 Gedore torque wrenches.



BRM wrote:It's funny that there are Always people that try to change topics into a simply sumup what they have and use instead of a reaction on the Original question in the Startpost.


I think you missed the half page explanation on torque wrenches that summarise things very well, including touching few words on the screw lubrication that impacts final torque and then forces on the threads.

Where I agree with BRM is that sharing what people own is in no case an insurance of quality if there is no real educated elements that guided the decision. For my case having a wrench I could calibrate was a go-no-go.


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sugarkane
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by sugarkane

ahh no @congbab repeatability and accuracy are important. if your gona work on you own bike then invest in good quality tools. trying to save money on tools that get a lot of use WILL be a costly exercise in time with tools and components needing replacement when your 'cheap' tool breaks or breaks the part your working on.

if you think that bike brand torque wrenchs are a bit pricey you should check out the cost of engineering or pro spec car torque wrenchs... its one of those things you choose the range you wana spend in and go from there..

2lo8
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by 2lo8

On bikes torque wrenches are just pretty much so hamfisted mechanics don't grossly (most well engineered parts don't slip if you're a little low or strip if you're a little high) overtighten or undertighten fasteners. It's just a warning to people that if the part still slips, they have other problems besides not being tight enough, or to reassure people afraid of damaging parts that they can (and should) torque it more than finger tight. I'm having a hard time thinking of any fastener on a bike that needs more than ballpark accuracy except some very fiddly internal exploding seatpost clamping mechanisms that require the application of carbon paste. You can't even get manufacturers to agree on torque for the same kind of screw used in the same way.

I still see lots of mechanics insist their arm is better than a low end torque wrench and refuse to touch the things too.
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evan326
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by evan326

BRM wrote:
evan326 wrote:
BRM wrote:I have 2 Gedore torque wrenches.



BRM wrote:It's funny that there are Always people that try to change topics into a simply sumup what they have and use instead of a reaction on the Original question in the Startpost.


You really think you can make a point by extracting 2 sentences from a whole writing?

You are the perfect example what is wrong with people on this forum.
You have a major problem with normal interpretation. (like many others here)

The focus is NOT on what I bought, on the contrary , the focus is on a method to buy an a brand depending on offers in your own location.

Very very different than just to dump in this topic just what I use.
My post is informative and helpfull to people that are in the market for a good deal on torque wrenches.


Your only post in this topic is trying to make me a fool.
There is no post from evan326 about the subject self.
Says enough about the intentions of evan326.
Too many people here that think and act like children and you are one of them.

The point was to hopefully show you how much of a hypocrite you are. You just did exactly what you were complaining about others doing. What is wrong with someone asking for opinions on torque wrenches, someone telling what they have and their opinion of it?
I have the harbor freight $28 torque wrench, it sucks. It isn't very accurate until you get past about 12nm. I am looking for a new, higher quality one. People's posts like Calnago's, WERE actually helpful to this thread. Unlike just about everything you post here.

mag
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Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 12:23 pm

by mag

If you live in the UK (or EU), check out the Norbar brand. They produce really good and accurate torque wrenches for various industrial uses. They come factory calibrated and are known for providing consistent results. But they're of those more expensive ones of course.

mvcap
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Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:50 pm

by mvcap

Great input here from all, thank you as I am learning quite a bit from the links, experience shared, and variety of what is owned by you.

It's too bad that every thread seems to ruffle feathers somehow and people start getting personal. I appreciate the constructive posts that have stayed on topic to help me with my original need, which is what makes a good torque wrench and is brand important. Clearly there is a lot to consider in this choice, and so your previous purchases and how those wrenches worked is absolutely helpful - puts context around price, accuracy, etc. Thank you!

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C36
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 3:24 am

by C36

2lo8 wrote:.
I still see lots of mechanics insist their arm is better than a low end torque wrench and refuse to touch the things too.


That's total nonsense on multiple aspects:
- I see lots: always concerned when see people saying "we alway use to...". Major source of fiascos...
- mechanic saying their arm is better is so ridiculous that just by this claim I would run away those guys. 10 years ago we ran tests over different "pro" mechanics in cars, motorbike, cycling and general machinery. I recall 2 things: bike mech already knew "arm tight" was rubbish and the best guy was not even within 30% over multiple tights. When you introduced more variables like the lubricant on the threads, data point were all over the place!

Torque wrenches require calibration cause it is important...




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2lo8
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by 2lo8

I know it's rubbish, my point was that bikes really don't require more than ballpark accuracy, which is my basis for why the lowly HF wrench is good enough. I think those mechanics are stupid too, that doesn't mean they can't assemble a bike.

Problems with fasteners and torque usually occur when something slips and people decide to keep cranking down on fasteners, even when they're already plenty tight. That or when something like a crank bolt or lockring is supposed to be really tight, but the person is afraid to use that much torque. If you have even a vague idea of what appropriate tightness should be and use carbon paste and such, you can assemble a bike without a torque wrench no problem. (Exception being aforementioned fiddly poorly designed seatpost mechanisms that slip even with paste and torqued to spec)

I can't even think off the top of my head what requires 3nm like in the torque test. Are people trying to preload their headsets with a torque wrench or something? Almost everything that needs to be torqued is M5 or bigger. Jockey pulleys maybe, if people actually use torque wrenches for that? My old Alien USE1 seatpost with the two tiny rail screws?

I know people like to pretend bikes are precision machines, but most don't even disassemble shifters, the one part with actual mechanical complexity. For bike assembly, the most precision is probably needed for wheelbuilding, and that uses a tensionmeter and a truing stand, not a torque wrench.
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Calnago
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by Calnago

I'd agree with @2lo8. But still, I like the confidence of knowing where I'm at, precisely. @2lo8... you made me laugh when you mentioned people trying to preload their headsets with a torque wrench. Why? Because I was one of those people way back during the time I got into serious wrenching and working on really nice bikes. Chris King would prescribe 12 inch pounds for the preload on their headsets. That's not a whole lot as you know, but to be sure, I scoured the hardware stores looking for a torque wrench that would be accurate at that low a torque. That's the Proto torque screwdriver you see on the far left of my pic. Cost me $$$ at the time I think. Trouble was, with friction between stems and steertubes as they are and spacers between the stem and the headset, there is some wiggle room before the whole assembly even starts to move, maybe even more than 12inch/pounds. So definitely yes, there are places where experience and feel do just as well, if not better sometimes, especially for the fine stuff. When in doubt, good judgement will suffice. Of course... there's always that chance, no matter how much care you take, or which tools you use... that you just want to look the other way when an awful sound is heard.

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BRM
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by BRM

Another perfect example how people ruin interesting informative topics with their meaningless posts.
Instead of clearing up the fuzziness around torque tools and how to use proper, people decide to blur this topic with their stupid anecdotes and other diary talk.

2lo8
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by 2lo8

So tell me what needs precisely 3nm of torque on a bike so we're not talking in fuzzy abstracts? Or any fastener that needs extreme precision on accuracy on a bike, not that having a better tool hurts anything, except the wallet.
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by Weenie


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Calnago
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by Calnago

@2lo8: Not sure who you're asking about a 3Nm torque spec. When I said you made me laugh it was in a good way, because I totally remember those days. Yours was a good post. But to clear up any "fuzziness", a front derailleur clamp bolt that secures the derailleur to a round seat tube is an example of something having a torque spec of around 3Nm, or even less. Also noticed a Dogma seatpost clamp I worked on over the weekend with a 3Nm torque spec on it. Most main bolts on a bike I'd say are spec'd in the 3-5Nm range. Bottom brackets and cassette lockrings need much more in the range of 40-60Nm. But you know all that so I'm not sure why you're asking. Do any of these have to be super "precise"? Probably not, but it's nice to know you've got it in the ballpark. And especially if you don't work on a lot of bike stuff and haven't developed that mechanics "feel", then torque wrenches are indispensable.

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