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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:16 pm 
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I have to say while folks can argue asthetics... I do not know how one can compare a lugged carbon such as the 585 or rsx to monocoque frames. That feel/ride/livliness is the difference for me. I know many love monocoque and it is what is most on offer these days...but for me I do not like them as they feel wooden.....just my opinion of course


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:20 pm 
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^ Agreed. Manufacturers can't match the feel of lugged carbon. The 585 and 595 were plenty stiff (get the Ultra if you thought the standard wasn't). They had all day comfort. They handled very well and were competitive weight wise for their time. Same with Colnago, give me a C50/C60 over a generic V1-r. If I want a monocoque 'aero' frame, I'd go with one of the big boys that actually knows what they are doing and is proven to know what they are doing.

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Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:20 pm 


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:54 pm 
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+1. I completely agree.

The number of manufacturers making frames today which excite me both aesthetically and functionally are few. So rare, in fact, unless I was getting a "throw-away" race bike, my attention for a new build immediately turns to bespoke/custom makers.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:59 pm 
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boysa wrote:
+1. I completely agree.

The number of manufacturers making frames today which excite me both aesthetically and functionally are few. So rare, in fact, unless I was getting a "throw-away" race bike, my attention for a new build immediately turns to bespoke/custom makers.

Totally. I was gonna go full custom T.I or maybe an English cycles until I got my rxr ulteamImage

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:13 pm 
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That is slick!

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:23 pm 
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The cheap wheels are are let down but since they are availavble as frame only that solves the problem.

Lugged carbon is nice. The kg221 is one such bike but it is quite a different animal.

If look just made lugged carbon frames, they would sell a few but not enough to keep them in business. Colnago do a lugged frame but it part of a bigger range and the c60 isprobably not there biggest seller. If all colnago did was lugged frames they would fold. It is well and good to want companies to produce frames of the past but if the market is small which it is then it is business model that may fail and be limited to low volumes custom builds. Look may have concluded the maRket is too small to justify production.

I love old bikes but if thats what you like buy an old one. One of my ideal builds would a bike with ti lugs and caron tubes. Stuff like that is custom only like the look 585 is now. Monocoque is cheaper to produce and the only thing golbalisation has done is force companies to reduce costs of manufacture to preserve margins.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:48 pm 
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bm0p700f wrote:
If look just made lugged carbon frames, they would sell a few but not enough to keep them in business.


Look did just fine when they were selling the 585 and 595 as their top road frame. That isn't the issue.


ab01ns wrote:
boysa wrote:
+1. I completely agree.

The number of manufacturers making frames today which excite me both aesthetically and functionally are few. So rare, in fact, unless I was getting a "throw-away" race bike, my attention for a new build immediately turns to bespoke/custom makers.

Totally. I was gonna go full custom T.I or maybe an English cycles until I got my rxr ulteamImage

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


Beautiful bike.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 12:44 am 
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53x12 wrote:
Look did just fine when they were selling the 585 and 595 as their top road frame. That isn't the issue.


Exactly & even before that they did very well & when teams like Kelme, Credit Agricole & CSC all rode their KG381
(Laurent Jalabert had his own signature painted kg481SL ? model)

Before I had a 585 I also owned a KG381 in Kelme Colors

I always said that bike descended like a hot knife thru butter
It handled so beautifully & inspired such confidence ...I loved it


Image


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 6:31 am 
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What a classy build. You no longer have it?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 7:13 am 
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boysa wrote:
What a classy build. You no longer have it?


Thanks boysa...If you mean that kg381?
& yes it was a great bike! :thumbup:

But I no longer have it :(


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 8:05 am 
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Yes, that is certainly the one. Very stylish.

Well, at least you have a picture... and the memories!

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 12:04 pm 
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Neither all lugged frames are the same nor all monocoques. Look produces lugged and monocoques since... always.
The fact is that ride quality does not matter that much to most consumers nowadays. They just want to ride whatever else rides or what they see on tv.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 2:52 pm 
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Posts: 177
Location: Beantown
I have a Look 595 which has been a great bike for me and is more or less in retirement since I bought a C60 two years ago. (also have a '96 DeRosa Primato that I'll never part with - likely one of the finest Columbus ELOS frames ever built).

Anyway, switched to C60 as I had the itch for something new and always admired the craftsmanship of Colnago. The frame is a beauty and the ride is sublime. Maybe not quite as responsive as the Look, but has a certain finesse and predictability that is hard to characterize.

Have toyed with idea of selling the Look, but after reading this thread - may hold on to her after all.

And as to Look in general...
Not a fan of their migration to proprietary parts at top of their line. I have being boxed in and having to pay for it.
The frames no longer strike me as all that distinctive.
Do hope they go back to offering high-end frames only, without all the other crap hanging off of them.

And as for euro brand bikes in US...
I'm here in Boston and it is getting harder and harder to find top end euro bikes. Walk into most any large bike shop in area and you'll see just three brands, Specialized, Trek and Cervelo. Belmont Wheelworks still has a few euro brands, but even they trend towards bespoke custom frame builds at the upper end (Moots, IF etc)
Sad state for those of us who love the Euro mystic - can't remember when I last saw a DeRosa, Look, Bianchi etc in a US bike shop.
But am delighted to see Canyon start their B2C program here in US. Hopefully that will shake things up a bit. Canyon has some great bikes.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 4:03 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2003 9:42 pm
Posts: 2389
the 695 is a fantastic bike. never had any issues with crank or stem. not as comfortable as the pinarello prince, but very quick. also, my time vxrs is still the most comfortable bike I have. the French make superb bikes.


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Posted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 4:03 pm 


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 6:36 pm 
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Location: Mallorca, Spain
I suspect most of our views of the "function" of a bike is totally driven by what it looks like, for me the LOOK brand frames stopped being lustworthy after the 595 when they started doing "swoopy" frames (695) then Bent TT ones. Im sure they still worked as well, but I lost the love, whereas Time, VXRS Id still love to have (even though I got a bit burned by an NXRS I put 6000 kms on last year but never came to love it. )


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