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PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 11:33 am 
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F10 has 'normal' tubes, exposed brakes and cables, non integrated cockpit, etc. etc. that's why the 'semi-aero' title. In TTs aerodynamics are important, of course, but there is not any non-aero TT frame to compare so... :)

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Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 11:33 am 


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 1:09 pm 
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kgt wrote:
F10 has 'normal' tubes, exposed brakes and cables, non integrated cockpit, etc. etc. that's why the 'semi-aero' title. In TTs aerodynamics are important, of course, but there is not any non-aero TT frame to compare so... :)


No way are the tubes on the F10 "normal" ... c'mon look at it man ... kammtail tubes all the way ... ... it's an aero frameset ... and Froome has used a one piece integrated cockpit ... see below

You're right though that it doesn't have all the aero bells and whistles some bikes have, but it's not alone in that regard. The Canyon Aeroad doesn't have integrated aero brakes for example

Oh and look a super narrow aero handlebar for Froome also ... that guy cares about aero

The F10, no question, is an aero bike ...

http://road.cc/content/tech-news/225663 ... -dogma-f10

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:18 pm 
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Ok, I guess it depends on what you call aero. Many frames have kammtail tubesets nowadays...
Froome does not always use the integrated cockpit btw, he didn't at the Vuelta.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 7:38 am 
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F8 was tested by Tour magazine in the wind tunnel as being as fast as S5, Venge and madone. F10 is faster than all these. Image



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:42 am 
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Great to see kgt rehashing literally the same argument year after year :roll:
viewtopic.php?p=1262816#p1262816


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:36 am 
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kgt wrote:
Ok, I guess it depends on what you call aero. Many frames have kammtail tubesets nowadays...
Froome does not always use the integrated cockpit btw, he didn't at the Vuelta.



See this crying face :lol:

Oh look, two wine glasses ... "cheers!" :beerchug:

A sign with the word "down" :up:

A thumbsdown :thumbup:

And this guy is so unfriendly .... :welcome:

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:37 pm 
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My arguments are still relevant, thank you. :)

If you want to follow a marketing trend that tries to persuade you to replace your frame every six months in order to get the "more aero one" that's your problem. I just find it sad.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 7:52 pm 
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to quote Ryan:

RyanH wrote:
Why do the naysayers keep coming into this thread? Do they have some deep need to troll?

How annoying would it be if someone kept posting in every weight thread about how caring about bicycle weight is pointless since a 1kg drop in weight is less than 2% of total rider weight and who cares about 2% since psychologically you can overcome that 2% or you could just sweat a little longer or take a bigger crap in the morning or or...

At the end of the day, there's going to be a group of people that believe in aero, just as there are people that believe in religion or don't. It's absurd to keep belaboring the same point over and over and over again in every thread that pops up about aero.

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You know who you are. please stop the debate for the sake of debate.

Thanks.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:43 pm 
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https://youtu.be/neFnyAE_noQ


Just a cycling guy's channel on YT. Has good stuff. This episode he did an aero test between Evo vs Madone 9.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 4:23 pm 
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jeffy wrote:
what are the frame sizes, wouldn't be to difficult to use the same bars, and use different stem positions to get as close as possible to identical setup.

the jump up to the propel could easily be accounted for by rider position in the wind.



It remains odd... the gap from the Propel to the better finishers is higher than I'd have thought the difference between an aero bike and total non-aero one....


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 5:57 pm 
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53x12 wrote:
https://youtu.be/neFnyAE_noQ


Just a cycling guy's channel on YT. Has good stuff. This episode he did an aero test between Evo vs Madone 9.
So.... the aero bike "saves" 10 seconds for every 10 minutes of riding or so.

So on my 3hr weekend outing, I would get home 3 minutes earlier if I had the aero bike!

Might be a deciding factor for some, and that's fine, but for 90% of amateur riders who don't race this supports just riding what you feel best on and brings you most joy, aero or not.



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PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 6:12 pm 
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Yes, exactly. I'd say 99% of riders. It's not worth running out and buying a new bike for but if you are shopping anyway, it's something to consider.

I do wonder how much the integrated cockpit accounts for the savings. Could I save 5 seconds on my Colnago C59 by installing an integrated aero bar/stem?

Then there is also the cheaper things you can do: aero wheels, aero helmet, tight fitting jersey, shoe covers, do core work and lower your stem, etc.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 6:18 pm 
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tikka wrote:
53x12 wrote:
https://youtu.be/neFnyAE_noQ


Just a cycling guy's channel on YT. Has good stuff. This episode he did an aero test between Evo vs Madone 9.
So.... the aero bike "saves" 10 seconds for every 10 minutes of riding or so.

So on my 3hr weekend outing, I would get home 3 minutes earlier if I had the aero bike!

Might be a deciding factor for some, and that's fine, but for 90% of amateur riders who don't race this supports just riding what you feel best on and brings you most joy, aero or not.

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That comes out to about 62s saved over 40km. I get it, you are an amateur and don't race. Why ride any kind of fancy bike. Might as well go down to a yard sale and get a $100 rusty bike, since you don't race and going any faster would be wasted for your slow ride on the bike path.

There are members on here that race. There are members on here that do fast group rides. There are members on here that enjoy going after Strava segment KOM.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 10:10 am 
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If it is for training only, wouldn't it be better using a bike that offers less benefit?
Possibly none against the top race bikes?
This seems to give you better training.
OFF TOPIC, but i noted riding a gravel with 650B 50-52mm tires 2 seasons, made me ride a road bike faster than before.

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Posted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 10:10 am 


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 11:30 am 
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tikka wrote:
53x12 wrote:
https://youtu.be/neFnyAE_noQ


Just a cycling guy's channel on YT. Has good stuff. This episode he did an aero test between Evo vs Madone 9.
So.... the aero bike "saves" 10 seconds for every 10 minutes of riding or so.

So on my 3hr weekend outing, I would get home 3 minutes earlier if I had the aero bike!

Might be a deciding factor for some, and that's fine, but for 90% of amateur riders who don't race this supports just riding what you feel best on and brings you most joy, aero or not.



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And the absurd is that in area where im riding a lot of guys buying more AERO, but using wider handlebars in same time. Im using NON Aero bike, but switched to narrower handlebar.. What do u think which is more Aero in the wind?Why i cant see the AERO frame guys have some advantage compared with me?

Also the faster rider here was using Bianchi Oltre XR2 and switched to S-Works SL5. .And he is even faster then he was (not because of frame, but because of his training...) Second faster guy ride Non Aero ORBEA frame (he dont train that much, but somehow naturally is really fast..) Third one riding non Aero Giant...


And the weight maybe it's marketing as well, but at least i can really feel it on the wheels or at least can measure my self (so having some satisfaction about that).

AERO is something u should believe what they claim and for me it's jurt marketing.. Dont make any sense.. The biggest frontal area in the wind is the rider him self. He'll safe more in Aero term, if he improve flexibility to be able to ride lower, and narrower vs buying most "Aero" bike..


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