Consider this switching to Tubeless

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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3Pio
Posts: 846
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:13 pm

by 3Pio

Hi there. This days since it's cold and slippery, i switched to riding MTB bike..

I have this bike for many years (Specialized Epic Marathon Carbon), and last 4 or 5 years riding using Tubeless setup (Mavic X819 disk rims and Stan Sealant most of the time, now Joe's NoFlat Sealent..) On last ride i had a flat, and since did not put more sealant recently, need to switch to inner tube on the road (no problems..)

Today, i wanted to just put new sealant and get back to tubeless.And i found that i have a problem. Seem that Rim have corrosion around valve hole, valve can't seal the hole.. I tried so many things, but worthless.. Now cant use this rim Tubeless anymore..I google it, and find out that ammonia in the sealent make this corrosion..

Why im posting this in Road section? Since most of the time im riding Road, and im active in this Road thread, and that im sure there is many who think should they switch tubeless on Road.. I didnt know that Sealent can activate corrosion on rims, and somehow destroy them.. So consider this as well, when u make decision for going tubeless on road.

For me seem that im switching to latex inner tubes on MTb as well...

And glad that year ago when i was buying my Shamals Ultra, picked the regular version, and not the 2Way Fit...

by Weenie


Fisherfreerider
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Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 1:19 am

by Fisherfreerider

Most sealants now do not contain ammonia. IIRC even Stans got away from it.

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mrgray
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by mrgray

perhaps another issue with tubeless is the failure mode. on weekend crit we had a chap have a puncture. rim instantly on very rough asphalt, he lost the front and went down and broke his wrist. took out another fellow who broke his hip! my understanding is that tubeless is very good with punctures generally because of the sealant, but that once it goes it can go quite quick (deflation).

interesting in that our local crits one cannot have a disc brake machine, but tubeless is OK. i wonder if there have been many such incidents and if the use of tubeless setups will come under some scrutiny at some point.
Bobo S&S Steel Bike - 7.5 kg
Oltre XR2- 6.6 kg
Look 585 - 6.8 kg

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boysa
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Location: Too far from my bike.

by boysa

I have had
the complete opposite experience. I find if I puncture on tubeless, it holds the rim much better than a standard clincher. Almost tubular-like. On top of that, the leaks are generally slow.
"Deserve's got nothing to do with it." William Munny

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Fixie82
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Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:45 am

by Fixie82

I've also had the opposite experience in that tubeless has saved me from a catastrophic failure while racing. The tubeless tyre (front wheel) retained enough pressure to allow me to keep riding instead of sliding out in a corner. In fact all of the punctures I've had on a tubeless set up have not deflated the tyre completely. This is across 3 sets of road wheels.

If his tubeless tyre deflated that quickly you can be sure the same would have happened to a standard tyre, inner tube set up.

peted76
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:30 pm

by peted76

The story of the fellow on the crit is not right.

It is simply not how 'tubeless' works. The sealant stops the instant release of pressure being released from the tyre thus stopping this kind of thing happening. It's possible he was running a ghetto tubeless setup, or had let his sealant dry up or run out or maybe he went round that corner on a flat expecting the same traction as without a flat.
Whatever the detail is, I expect we'll never know but it's not right.

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Miller
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Location: Reading, UK

by Miller

It can happen. I had a tubeless front flat that deflated quickly enough to dump me into a thankfully soft verge. Tubeless does not equal invulnerable, sealant won't cover a slash in the tyre.

But most of the time, and I mean 80%-90%, the air leak is slow and a lower level of pressure is retained.

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Fixie82
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by Fixie82

Miller - your experience is exactly why I said if it happened to a tubeless tyre the same would have happened to a standard tyre/inner tube set up.

I took issue with the blanket 'failure mode' statement that once it goes, it goes quick. This is exactly the same 'failure mode' for an inner tube. So not sure why it would be compared to disc brakes and a needed increase of scrutiny?

kode54
Posts: 1125
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm

by kode54

i got a puncture with tubeless on the front tire...big hole, high pressure didn't seal it...but keeping pressure low did. enough to make it home.

i find it more of an insurance policy during winter. i hate getting punctures when its freezing out...and use sealant so i don't have to deal with it. most of the time, it will seal it enough for me to make it home...which is all i really ask for.
i haven't seen any damage caused by it so far. and in some of my other tire set ups...i drop sealant in the tube for added peace of mind.
- AX Lightness Vial EVO D + DA9150 + Enve SES 3.4 carbon hubs
- Parlee Altum + DA9150 + Enve SES 4.5 carbon hubs
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- Independent Fabrication Ti FLW + DA9100 + Enve 3.4 CK hubs

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Miller
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Location: Reading, UK

by Miller

Fixie82 wrote:Miller - your experience is exactly why I said if it happened to a tubeless tyre the same would have happened to a standard tyre/inner tube set up.

I took issue with the blanket 'failure mode' statement that once it goes, it goes quick. This is exactly the same 'failure mode' for an inner tube. So not sure why it would be compared to disc brakes and a needed increase of scrutiny?


Well, I agree with all your comments here. Damage that fully deflates a tubeless setup would certainly have taken out a clincher equivalent. If you do get an air leak, it's generally slow and the sealant will seal after a pressure loss. Further, after a little time my experience is you can whack the tyre back up to full pressure with no more drama.

But what I most like about tubeless is - no inner tube! It's so cool.

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mrgray
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by mrgray

interesting to hear users opinions that far from being a standard failure, instant deflation is unusual perhaps (and no more likely than when say a clincher is being used). how often does one refresh the sealant ideally or does it vary dramatically depending on temperature and usage etc?
Bobo S&S Steel Bike - 7.5 kg
Oltre XR2- 6.6 kg
Look 585 - 6.8 kg

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F45
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by F45

Latex tubes are very good at slowing down deflation.

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Fixie82
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by Fixie82

mrgray wrote: instant deflation is unusual perhaps (and no more likely than when say a clincher is being used). how often does one refresh the sealant ideally or does it vary dramatically depending on temperature and usage etc?


Instant deflation is less likely than a standard clincher set up. Much less. Any puncture on a standard clincher will deflate completely, it will be very rare that a tubeless set up will do the same and as already stated if a tubeless set up deflates totally, so will anything else.

As for sealant, it does depend on the amount of sealant used and the weather conditions but I always check around the 2-3 month mark. Usually doesn't need topping up until the 4-6 month mark. This is with MTB mostly but my road tyres are still good after 3 months.

by Weenie


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