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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:34 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2015 11:42 pm
Posts: 30
I've had a look on here and other forums, but can't seem to find a conclusive answer.

What is the correct method for removing a Campagnolo RD (chorus, record or SR) from a RD hanger? I previously tried to do this using a T25 torx key from the drive side, and somehow ended up either rounding out the bolt or shearing it in two (the mounting bolt now spins freely when I turn the T25, but the RD remains attached to the hanger). Luckily my hanger is removable, so I just took it off, popped a new one on and also had a spare RD knocking around (long story).

The drive side of the bolt is recessed, and it's a T25 (I did install the RD this way). I have tried undoing the RD using this side of the bolt - it requires a hell of a lot of force - it worked once before, but when tried a second time at a later stage, the bolt either snapped in its middle, or rounded out (although it doesn't look like it has rounded).

On the NDS of the same mounting bolt, there is a recess shaped for a hex key. None of my hexs fit it, but I am wondering whether this side should be used to remove the mech (similar to as detailed in this thread http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtop ... t=12914193). Page 18 of this http://www.campagnolo.com/media/files/0 ... part_A.pdf shows the construction of the mounting bolt, and at least tells me what spare parts I'll need to salvage derailleur #1

On the off chance I need to remove it in future, how should this be done?


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Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:34 pm 


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:51 pm 
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Sounds like you've stripped the bolt head from the drive side (where you need a long torx wrench to get at). It's a Torx 25 and it sounds like the wrench is just spinning around as opposed to spinning the bolt itself. You can remove it from the back of the hanger, except it should still be a Torx25, not a hex key, and not a Torx 30, which it used to be before the redesign. Just keep in mind which way you need to turn it from that side to loosen it, bearing in mind it's the same bolt.
It's recommended torque is quite high (10-12Nm) which is still less than it used to be but takes a fair bit of force. Since it sounds like the bolt head from the drive side entry is now stripped, that is unusable. So just use the backside and make sure you don't strip it as well. Are your tools in good shape? Get a proper good set of Torx wrenches if you don't have them. And some good bits and a torque wrench if you don't have one. Don't rely on cheap multitools or the like for that. I generally torque that bolt down, from the backside, using a good Torx bit and torque wrench to 9-9.5Nm. I just think that's plenty even though slightly shy of the recommended 10-12Nm.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 12:29 pm 
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Location: bottom edge of Australia
I've done this before to a Record r/d- inserted a cheap inadequate length T25 from the drive side of the bolt and going to town with not enough lug/bolt surface contact (doh :oops: )..... in a mad hurry to sell a frameset.

I escaped a stickier fate by being able to neatly use a T27 gently tapped into the bolt hole to get it undone - lasted for best part of 6 years before I broke the r/d for good in a collision.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:46 pm 
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Location: UK
Calnago wrote:
Sounds like you've stripped the bolt head from the drive side (where you need a long torx wrench to get at). It's a Torx 25 and it sounds like the wrench is just spinning around as opposed to spinning the bolt itself. You can remove it from the back of the hanger, except it should still be a Torx25, not a hex key, and not a Torx 30, which it used to be before the redesign. Just keep in mind which way you need to turn it from that side to loosen it, bearing in mind it's the same bolt.
It's recommended torque is quite high (10-12Nm) which is still less than it used to be but takes a fair bit of force. Since it sounds like the bolt head from the drive side entry is now stripped, that is unusable. So just use the backside and make sure you don't strip it as well. Are your tools in good shape? Get a proper good set of Torx wrenches if you don't have them. And some good bits and a torque wrench if you don't have one. Don't rely on cheap multitools or the like for that. I generally torque that bolt down, from the backside, using a good Torx bit and torque wrench to 9-9.5Nm. I just think that's plenty even though slightly shy of the recommended 10-12Nm.


Spot apply (don't spray it'll end up in places it shouldn't) Plus Gas release lubricant. Then, as Cal says above, use a good quality T25 from the back.

When refitting - Pay attention to the fitting notes and run an M10 x 1 (not a standard M10) tap through the hanger before refitting and use a good anti-galling paste (or grease at a pinch) on the top pivot bolt and reassemble at 10 nm.

A lot of RD hangers there days are anodised post-tapping and that can tighten the thread clearances. Even though Campagnolo soft-anodise the bolt in part to prevent problems with corrosion and this can help a bit with galling issues, the problem is that if the hanger thread is tight and galling occurs, even a 10 nm tightening torque can translate to more like a 20 nm release torque, more than a T25 socket in alloy is really specced to withstand.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2017 2:48 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2015 11:42 pm
Posts: 30
appreciate the advice gents. I have a Park Tool T25 tool - I'll get some of that releasing fluid and give it a go - will update in due course.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:19 pm 
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I did not have any success - to the point where my T25 has deformed (the "teeth" have bent, relative to the direction of torque!), and begun to round out the bolt from the NDS. I've sent the derailleur to the national service centre (thanks Graeme) to have the bolt drilled. Hopefully applying anti-seize prevents this from happening in the future.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 1:30 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm
Posts: 1064
i apply copper anti-seize to the RD bolt. mainly because of wet weather riding...i'm always afraid that it would rust or seize in the hanger.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:45 am 
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Location: Albuquerque, NM
Have to chime in here. I shipped my bike four times last year for events. Every time I took my Record 11 derailleur off, it was very hard, and after it made a sickening popping sound, it gave an odor of burned metal. Almost a welding smell. I used grease the first two times, and anti-seize the last two times. Nothing seemed to help. I installed with a torque wrench, so I know it wasn't too tight. Never an issue, just something I noticed every time I took it off.

Edit: This was on a Look 695 with aluminum derailleur hanger.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:28 am 
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Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2015 11:42 pm
Posts: 30
Thanks for your input - that's describes exactly my experience, including the sound and the smell! A bit worrying to hear that grease and antiseize haven't helped...


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 10:20 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:31 am
Posts: 151
Location: Brighton, UK
They're seized together. I had an identical issue and it took a mechanic 2 days to separate them. I could've been a bit more liberal with the grease though. Christ knows why Campag decided to ditch the 5mm allen bolt of old and replace it with a crappy torx bolt. I do wonder about that company sometimes...


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 11:41 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2006 2:36 am
Posts: 1353
Location: UK
I use low strength loctite. It fills any gaps and doesn't allow any ingress of moisture. No problems removing it.

If I didn't use loctite I'd definitely use anti-seize or Morgan Blue Aquaproof paste rather than standard grease.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:36 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2012 12:49 am
Posts: 502
same experience here...all of my Campy rear derailleurs, mechanical or EPS have been difficult to remove despite installing with proper torque. I stripped an SR EPS RD, and snapped the hanger -- ended up having to send it away for removal and bolt replacement. Been applying copper anti-seize and although I no longer strip them, they're still difficult to remove. almost seems like they tighten over time.


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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:36 am 


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:41 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2015 11:42 pm
Posts: 30
Well, this isn't much consolation, but I'm glad to hear I'm not the only person having this issue...


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