Canyon Aeroad CF SLX frame crack

[kgt]

In terms of Canyon Ultimate, it seems to have very thin engineering margin because it is so light.
The only way to make CFRP bike frames lighter is to apply less carbon layup. There is no way around this.

I totally agree. All superlight frames have their limitations in terms of strength.
That's the reason frames from Colnago (and others) are 'heavy'. It's not that they cannot make a ww frame. They just don't want failures like the one mentioned to ever happen to their frames.

[mattr]

And its not new, or restricted to carbon frames, some superlight aluminium frames were fragile in a similar way.

[kgt]

+1

[scottmmw]

Some people seem to be curious about the accident I was referring to. So, here it goes.

1. Broken fork can be identified in the photo I attached.

2. He got badly injured. His arm bone was even damaged because his arm was so badly scratched.

3. No outside force was applied to the fork.
No road block was there.

4. Canyon Korea is investgating the issue and it will decide how to handle the warranty claim soon.

I'm also in manufacturing industry.

What I realized from 4 years of exprience is there will always be faulty mass manufacturing process, so we should have wider engineering margin than what is needed in labotory situation to prevent faulty products that are even hard to find in QC process.

In terms of Canyon Ultimate, it seems to have very thin engineering margin because it is so light.
The only way to make CFRP bike frames lighter is to apply less carbon layup. There is no way around this.

I think the issue here is not product engineering.
Instead, Canyon engineered extreremly lightweight frames which have thin engineering margin.

That thin margin could result in disasterous accidents if it combines with manufacuring mishaps and spotty QC process.

Someone was referring to CT scan results. However, always keep in mind that CFRP frames are entirely manufactured by hands which mean they are susceptible to human errors, and Canyon outsources its manufacturing which means its QC process might have higher rate of failure.

I'm a big fan of Canyon Bicycles.
Although, I hope it should focus more on reliability, less on lightweight.

So canyon have one failure in Korea and you believe they have a serious QC problem... Please divide the number sold compared to failures and tell me how that is a serious issue? Every single item every made will have a failure, it depends on the severity as to the action required to rectify!

[Tomdaws]

I've got an Aeroad & yes the top tube is clearly very thin walled, however, I'm very surprised it could be damaged by leaning on it ?

I recently had a relatively minor 'off' & went over the bars, the bars spun round & hit the top tube causing it to split.
I'm not exactly happy about it, but I'm not surprised either, it's just the way it goes. Hopefully it's not going to happen very often !
I've had a couple of bikes from Canyon & I've experienced a few minor niggles with quality, but nothing that I would consider a danger, & each one was satisfactorily resolved by Canyon. I'd certainly buy from them again.

For me, buying a bike like this, I accept that it's not going to be the most robust of frames - it's light & relatively cheap('pick two').
Again, I accept that there are probably better quality frames available, maybe an F8 ? but I choose to take the cheaper option, & consider it a 'tool' rather than a dream bike.

[Kongbop]

I never heard about Aeroad CF SLX's crack(also I'm using Aeroad too) Why don't you contact with CANYON?
But sometimes heard about Ultimate CF SLX.

[DavidMLee]

Some people seem to be curious about the accident I was referring to. So, here it goes.

1. Broken fork can be identified in the photo I attached.

2. He got badly injured. His arm bone was even damaged because his arm was so badly scratched.

3. No outside force was applied to the fork.
No road block was there.

4. Canyon Korea is investgating the issue and it will decide how to handle the warranty claim soon.

I'm also in manufacturing industry.

What I realized from 4 years of exprience is there will always be faulty mass manufacturing process, so we should have wider engineering margin than what is needed in labotory situation to prevent faulty products that are even hard to find in QC process.

In terms of Canyon Ultimate, it seems to have very thin engineering margin because it is so light.
The only way to make CFRP bike frames lighter is to apply less carbon layup. There is no way around this.

I think the issue here is not product engineering.
Instead, Canyon engineered extreremly lightweight frames which have thin engineering margin.

That thin margin could result in disasterous accidents if it combines with manufacuring mishaps and spotty QC process.

Someone was referring to CT scan results. However, always keep in mind that CFRP frames are entirely manufactured by hands which mean they are susceptible to human errors, and Canyon outsources its manufacturing which means its QC process might have higher rate of failure.

I'm a big fan of Canyon Bicycles.
Although, I hope it should focus more on reliability, less on lightweight.

So canyon have one failure in Korea and you believe they have a serious QC problem... Please divide the number sold compared to failures and tell me how that is a serious issue? Every single item every made will have a failure, it depends on the severity as to the action required to rectify!

Well, I partially agree with you.

However, when it comes to riders' safety, I gotta say even one failure that could claim lives matters to me.

I think this might be the same to every rider.

Also, Canyon community in Korea reported more than 10 frame failures I know.

Ultimates' seat stay was cracked without any outside force,
Aeroads' top tube cracked when a rider sat on it.

Severity of these issues might vary, but I have to say Canyon should double down on QC process.

Or, they can allow wider engineering margin.

[kkibbler]

I'd take those 10 frame failures with a grain of salt, if WW is any indication 8 of those are from new members with Korean usernames spamming for Starbike discounts.

I bet Canyon's biggest customer base is in Europe. If we don't see those QC-failure numbers in Europe I'd call it a fluke or just bad luck.

In my area I know of exactly 1 Canyon frame crack and that was on an Aeroad that had apparently picked up a pebble and got it jammed between the rear tire and the seat tube.

[Nefarious86]

I know of 3 that have cracked..... To be fair 2 belonged to the same guy and were both big race crashes and the 3rd met with a car....

[DavidMLee]

I'd take those 10 frame failures with a grain of salt, if WW is any indication 8 of those are from new members with Korean usernames spamming for Starbike discounts.

I bet Canyon's biggest customer base is in Europe. If we don't see those QC-failure numbers in Europe I'd call it a fluke or just bad luck.

In my area I know of exactly 1 Canyon frame crack and that was on an Aeroad that had apparently picked up a pebble and got it jammed between the rear tire and the seat tube.

Thanks for your sincere opinion on 'Korean usernames.'

Even if I only write on WW for starbike discount, Canyon's problems won't go away.

Also, if I just wanted just coupon, I would just do 'spamming', which is not about posting a lengthy replies with an image.

I understand you might be loyal to Canyon, but sometimes, open commucation about negative issues would improve your beloved brand's overall product quality and strengthen consumers' loyalty.

I actually have a plan to order Canyon's Ultimate CF SLX.
Shady consumer service is what makes me procrastinate, tho.

Ride safe and have a good day.

[fignonsbarber]

Guys, when Canyon says not to sit on the top tube, I think they are referring to not sitting on the TT when RIDING, ala Froome descending on the top tube.

[Tobic]

A friend of mine also cracked his Aeroad top tube this year - slipped out of a corner, bars flipped around and slammed into the top tube, causing longitudinal cracks opposite of the impact site and the (3T aeronova) carbon handlebars to snap as well. Looked like the carbon fibres in the top tube are laminated mostly longitudinally. Maybe thats the way Canyon ensures that the head tube and front end is super stiff, with the trade-off that the top tube is less stable to impacts form the side.
Regarding the CF SLX, I crashed my 2016 CF SLX heavily this summer when slipping out of a high-velocity corner - all good besides some scratches on my right DA STI and the rear dropout, and the aerocockpit didn't show a single scratch. Maybe not that flimsy after all?

[Tomdaws]

A friend of mine also cracked his Aeroad top tube this year - slipped out of a corner, bars flipped around and slammed into the top tube, causing longitudinal cracks opposite of the impact site and the (3T aeronova) carbon handlebars to snap as well. Looked like the carbon fibres in the top tube are laminated mostly longitudinally. Maybe thats the way Canyon ensures that the head tube and front end is super stiff, with the trade-off that the top tube is less stable to impacts form the side.
Regarding the CF SLX, I crashed my 2016 CF SLX heavily this summer when slipping out of a high-velocity corner - all good besides some scratches on my right DA STI and the rear dropout, and the aerocockpit didn't show a single scratch. Maybe not that flimsy after all?

I reckon you could be spot on regarding the 'delicate' top tube. Likewise, my aerocockpit has taken a couple of falls without any apparent damage.

I'm not complaining about the frame at all though, I really love how it rides, but I'm still hoping I get the chance to try the Ultimate CF SLX next.