Caad9 Hollowgram help

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BLD25
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:24 pm

by BLD25

Hello, all, first post here, but I am definitely guilty of being a "budget weight weenie." My caad9 is in the mid 15lb range with cages, pedals, etc, and I just picked up some hollowgrams which should definitely help in my quest.

I have done a lot of reading on different hollowgram install/removal advice, youtube videos, and help from others, but I wanted to see if anyone else had some specific caad9 tips. It seems that a guy named starnut is an expert, but he may not be around as much, or at least on the roadbike forum.

Specifically, which side and how many spacers would I need for the caad9? I have seen where some put the spindle in the freezer to get it in, and spray stuff on it to cool it to get it out. Also, it appears that as far as removal goes, I can put a socket extension in the through the NDS side after removing the crank bolt, and then use a standard crank puller as opposed to the expensive cannondale one. And then, do I just use a mallet to get the spindle and DS out?

Like I said, I have done my reading, just hoping to consolidate some info if anyone is willing to help.

Thanks again!

Brian

topflightpro
Posts: 829
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 2:35 am

by topflightpro

When I had a Caad 9 and original Hollowgrams, I had the spacers on the DS. The number of spacers is somewhat trial and error. I think I used two or three. The washer also was on the DS.

I never needed to freeze the spindle to install it. I used a rubber mallet to tap it in and out of the frame with no issues.

I have no ideal how to remove the crank arms without the Cannondale crank-remover tools.

Finally, the instructions on the Cannondale website were always pretty good, IMO. I printed out the PDF several years ago, though they are slightly different with the new SISL stuff I have.

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BLD25
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:24 pm

by BLD25

thanks! I kind of expected more replies, anyone else have any luck with the caad9?

DamonRinard
in the industry
Posts: 396
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 8:32 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

by DamonRinard

No specific CAAD9 tips, the bearings are in the same place as any BB30 frame (with normal manufacturing variation).

Spacers: Put enough on the drive side so your chainline is 43.5 +/- 1.5mm. Then add or remove spacers on the left until the bearing preload is right. Some spindles have a shoulder; in that case, spacers needed on that side.

Installing spindle: Rubber mallet should do it. Freezing is a nice trick but optional. Just make sure there is nothing in between them except clean grease. A tiny bit of grit can stop the spindle.

Socket extension: Nice trick, I did not know that. :-)

Did you have a look at the manuals?
Damon Rinard
Engineering Manager, Road Bikes
Cycling Sports Group, Cannondale
Ex-Kestrel, ex-Velomax, ex-Trek, ex-Cervelo

BLD25
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:24 pm

by BLD25

DamonRinard wrote:No specific CAAD9 tips, the bearings are in the same place as any BB30 frame (with normal manufacturing variation).

Spacers: Put enough on the drive side so your chainline is 43.5 +/- 1.5mm. Then add or remove spacers on the left until the bearing preload is right. Some spindles have a shoulder; in that case, spacers needed on that side.

Installing spindle: Rubber mallet should do it. Freezing is a nice trick but optional. Just make sure there is nothing in between them except clean grease. A tiny bit of grit can stop the spindle.

Socket extension: Nice trick, I did not know that. :-)

Did you have a look at the manuals?



Thanks, as far as the manual goes, I bought both the frame and cranks used. Maybe i can find the hollowgram manual online.

DamonRinard
in the industry
Posts: 396
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 8:32 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

by DamonRinard

Yep, I'm pretty sure the manuals should be available online. There are several versions over the years, so although the principles are the same, the details of which and how many spacers of what thickness, vary a lot with crank version. But not with the frame, as long as it's BB30, as is your CAAD9.

BTW, I saw a typo in my answer: if the spindle has a shoulder, then "no" spacers are needed on that side.
Damon Rinard
Engineering Manager, Road Bikes
Cycling Sports Group, Cannondale
Ex-Kestrel, ex-Velomax, ex-Trek, ex-Cervelo

BLD25
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:24 pm

by BLD25

thanks. I am hoping to minimize installation and removal, and just want to try to get it right the first time if I can!

rheosibal
Posts: 315
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2013 10:26 pm
Location: LA

by rheosibal

So this will be long. PM me if anything.

Which hollowgrams are you using? Nothing will be specific to the CAAD9, but the spacing is determined by hollowgram model (SL v Si v SiSL2) & axle combination (104 v 109).

Hollowgrams are a pain in the ass, but worth your time and struggle once you get the hang of it. If you just picked up a set, I wouldn't worry to much about the removal of the cranks, but just focus on installing. I'm sure your removal method will work. After installing and reinstalling my cranks a million times, here's a few tips that I've learned from screwing up.

I've been using SiSl2s with the designated 109 spindle.

1) If you're using regular chainrings or a spidering, install it onto the spindle, torque to spec, and STICK IT IN THE FREEZER for like 20 min. THE WHOLE DRIVESIDE/SPINDLE. I'm sure you've read, sticking it in the freezer will help the materials contract blah blah blah, thus making it easier to slide in. Trust me, it works.

**If you're using a DS power meter (quarq for example), do the same as above, but start with the NDS arm. Meaning, torque the NDS with the axle, then freeze, leaving the DS arm/spider/chainring left.

2) After 20 min, heat those bearings up with a heat gun, blow dryer, lighter, whatever you have to make it hot. Put the spacers/bearing shields/wave washer/shims on both sides and slide that sucker in, then torque the NDS side.

It's tedious, but from my experience, the axle/bearing contact points are TIGHT. Once that spindle warms up, that sucker won't move. And if it's not set perfectly, your chainline might be off, one side may be overtorqued, etc. This works for me every time. Chainline is perfect, and your bearings will last a looooong time.
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BLD25
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:24 pm

by BLD25

thanks, everyone, it wasn't that bad after all! the freezing the spindle(even an ice pack on it for awhile) really helped, as did the trick of the metal rod in the spindle to remove the arms with a standard crank puller.

The only real bummer, is that it appears that the spider may be bent slightly as the rings don't move in a perfect circular motion, but rather side to side. I let a neighbor kid(4yo) feel how light the NDS arm and spindle were and he dropped it in the kitchen, but surely a 1ft fall on the NDS wouldn't affect that. I suppose the spider thing is the issue. I know it is replaceable, but I don't want to spend any more on this.

Anyway, thanks to all who helped. I now know how to work on hollowgrams!

natefontaine
Posts: 249
Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:37 am

by natefontaine

An easy way to remove the spindle is to take a can of compressed air an spray it upside-down into the spindle. You can easily slide it out.

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by Weenie


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topflightpro
Posts: 829
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 2:35 am

by topflightpro

BLD25 wrote:The only real bummer, is that it appears that the spider may be bent slightly as the rings don't move in a perfect circular motion, but rather side to side. I let a neighbor kid(4yo) feel how light the NDS arm and spindle were and he dropped it in the kitchen, but surely a 1ft fall on the NDS wouldn't affect that. I suppose the spider thing is the issue. I know it is replaceable, but I don't want to spend any more on this.


Check the chainring pin. I had that issue once when I bought some new chainrings. I was changing spiders back to Standard from Compact and thought at first that I must have bent the spider at some point, but it turned out the pin was just too long and was pushing against the crankarm, making the rings not straight.

I filed the pin down with a basic metal file until it fit OK.

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