Campagnolo Rear Derailleur Issue

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maverick_1
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by maverick_1

@Calnago,
Was having an impression that your 2015 SR RD was working fine, based on the below thread..
Or was it merely a misunderstanding from my part?

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=137418&start=45

Cheers

BlackMadone
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by BlackMadone

Here's my 2015 RD its not derailing but it looks like it has some bend in it. It rides silently and shifts perfectly too.

Image
Image

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maverick_1
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by maverick_1

@BlackMadone,
Thanks for sharing. Is the picture taken with the small to small combo?
Or was it on the largest chainring?
I have to say the slant on the lower pulley looks pretty severe though..

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jekyll man
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by jekyll man

black madones mech hanger looks bent if you compare sprocket to frame/ hanger between top and bottom.

Could be a bad photo though
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caballero
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by caballero

@blackmadone Bent hanger ????

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Calnago
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by Calnago

@Maverick_1: I had this issue early last summer. It drove me nuts for a while. Replacing the cage solved the issue for me. And I can't even rule out that there was nothing wrong with the cage and it may have been just assembled just slightly off. That's what I want to test on the next build. But it certainly doesn't seem to be a common issue at all. There's so many things I'd be checking before this if your drivetrain isn't perfect.
Since I experienced two derailleurs like that I thought the odds of that happening were very small and others must have had the experience as well. So I was following that thread you referenced. You seem to be someone who described a similar thing with yours. It may be just a very isolated issue since it happened months ago and I couldn't find anyone else who I could definitively say was having the same exact issue for the same reason. For instance, in BlackMadones pics above that hanger does look bent and I would check it carefully with an alignment tool.
In my case, you could not even run the chain in small/small during setup (no cables attached) just to get chain length adjusted without it derailing.
And @Nefarious86, yes we all know small/small is not a combo you should ever find yourself in but it should still be perfectly useable in a properly set up Campy drive train. Every gear combination is useable if set up right.
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Bridgeman
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by Bridgeman

I endured this problem with my purchase of the first 11sp Super Record RD offer. The twisted cage just kept getting worse until I had to replace it. It never shifted as well as the new 2014 Chorus RD. It wasn't even close. I think Campy owes me money for spending so much and never experiencing the performance commensurate with its cost.

Carbon fiber has excellent in plane stiffness qualities. Not so good when there is a torsional load in play. Elastomeric/resin creep is the culprit.

A final thought; If Campy purposely integrated a twist for some sort of bias for optimization then why is this twist not present of the Chorus version? An additionally puzzling property of this material choice is that the twist, in my case anyway, got worse with time. I don't remember when Campy first introduce the carbon fiber cage but they have had years of product in the field and have certainly received feedback on this issue by now, yet the problem is still present.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

I remember reading your post Bridgeman, and don't know what to say. I have worked with a lot of 11sp Super Record carbon rear cages since it was first introduced in 2009 and they have all worked flawlessly except for this one instance. And I certainly never experienced a progressively worsening effect. Thats why I didn't think your issue was the same as mine, but perhaps it's related. It was next to impossible to tell by eye the difference between the "good one" and the "bad one". I had to troubleshoot extensively and go through a couple of new chains changing things in and out, back and forth, and controlling for everything else before isolating it to the cage. And like I alluded to above, after all that it may have been just an assembly issue from the factory. In any case, I will have the opportunity to test one more thing in a couple of weeks or so but mostly it's for my own interest at this point as everything is all good now and there certainly doesn't seem to be widespread reports of this. I just hope that from my posting a bunch of people don't start jumping to any conclusions about their own systems. If your chain runs in the small small without derailing at the lower pulley, then it's likely not related to what I'm referring to in this post. But thanks for posting.
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BlackMadone
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by BlackMadone

My pics were taken in little/little and big/little. It could be bent some just bumped into it and it fell over.

lynton
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by lynton

BlackMadone wrote:My pics were taken in little/little and big/little. It could be bent some just bumped into it and it fell over.



It certainly looks bent. When you look at the inside edge of the hanger in relation to the line of the smallest sprocket the hanger has a definite bend inboard. It is only a mm or two at he hanger but that results in a significant misalignment at the derailleur.

meecats1
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by meecats1

Hello.
I'm new to this and need some advise. I've got a Willer GTR 2015 with a Athena Groupset. 11-28. 50-34T (think thats right)
As i live in surrey i wanted a 11-32 cassesste, so i've brought one from IRD which is campy compatible. Now i've been told that i might need a medium cage derailler, and i've no idea if that the case. If so which one? or can it not be done..


Any thanks.

lynton
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by lynton

meecats1 wrote:Hello.
I'm new to this and need some advise. I've got a Willer GTR 2015 with a Athena Groupset. 11-28. 50-34T (think thats right)
As i live in surrey i wanted a 11-32 cassesste, so i've brought one from IRD which is campy compatible. Now i've been told that i might need a medium cage derailler, and i've no idea if that the case. If so which one? or can it not be done..


Any thanks.


I am going to assume you have a 2015 group set and therefore 11 speed. If that is the case the RD has a limitation of 29 for the max number of teeth on the rear cassette. So a 32 exceeds that and will cause problems. If you have a 10 speed the max teeth is 30 so you still have a problem.

In terms of teeth capacity (28-11)+(50-34)=33 you are on the limit of the capacity of that RD but theoretically it is ok.
It is the max number of teeth that is an issue and a medium cage will not fix it. 11 speed Athena only has short and long cage RD but both have a max number of teeth of 29 so a long cage is no help to you.
That is why Campagnolo 11 speed cassettes only go up to 29 teeth.
You may be able to adjust the spring tension to push the top jockey wheel down clear of a 32 cog but it will be close if it is possible.

meecats1
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Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:31 am

by meecats1

Thanks,
I understand that now.
What's the answer if it doesn't work? Can I use different RD.. or am I screwed..

lynton
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by lynton

meecats1 wrote:Thanks,
I understand that now.
What's the answer if it doesn't work? Can I use different RD.. or am I screwed..


Talking in theory as I have not actually tried to get a 32 tooth working on Campagnolo 11 speed, if someone has and has actual experience feel free to correct me.

To run a 32 sprocket on an Athena RD in either short or long cage it is not going to work as the RD has a limitation of 29 teeth. To do this you would have to run a MTB RD which have a capacity for larger sprockets but the problem is Campagnolo don't have a MTB range.

So to run that 32 you have to look at other manufacturers for a RD in a MTB product. The issue here is Campagnolo use a different cable pull ratio than shimano and sram so those derailleurs are not immediately compatible. I have read that you can run a shimano RD on Campagnolo 11 speed shifters if you use a shimano 10 speed cassette. To do this you have to use an alternative cable clamp position but apparently it works. Sure you lose a gear but you do get that 32 cog. Other option is to change to a shimano group set and run a Deore XT dérailleur on a Ultegra 11 speed group which may not be ideal but shimano do have greater flexibility as they have a MTB range.
This is quite an interesting article on the subject, http://www.cxmagazine.com/shimano-campa ... patibility

meecats1
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Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:31 am

by meecats1

Thanks.

Sounding grief I must say.. Be easier to change the whole groupset.. Or wait for the new Potenza group set to come out, that RD can handle 11-32 cassette if I read right...

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