Zipp Grade 2 Bearings???

[ergott]

I simply think that if you were to ask 100 people why they chose Zipps, bearing grade would not be at the top of the list of reasons. I don't own them so maybe I'm off base. Hell people still buy them even though their hubs have such a hit or miss reputation for durability.



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[goodboyr]

Ok. You found an error buried on their website. I'm with ergott. I doubt any zipp owners even know what "grade number" their bearing balls are. And thats not why they bought the wheels.

[beanbiken]

I doubt any zipp owners even know what "grade number" their bearing balls are. And thats not why they bought the wheels.

Yep, own ZIpp FC303's plus 2 other brands of CF wheels and bearing grade was not a factor in my decision with any of them.

Steve

[eschelar]

I'm not going to deny that it's not a pivotal buying decision for every customer. But I don't really understand why people are so quick to defend a company that has been caught out simply because it's not something they care about. After all, if people aren't buying their wheels because of marketing claims, then why do they buy them? I think it's a bit silly to suggest that marketing doesn't play a role in people's purchasing decisions. The fact is that ceramic bearings don't make a scrap of difference to the wheel. But Zipp claims that they do. Further, they claimed specifically that they were using a grade of bearing that doesn't even exist... Until they were caught of course...

If that doesn't remind you of Lance, I'm a bit surprised. Claiming something for years that something that is stated

The last time you bought an energy drink, you probably didn't buy it because of the L-Arginine. But if the company were to lie about the quantity of L-arginine, they'd still be in a good bit of trouble. Not only that, but this would be an issue of trust.

Zipp has some pretty interesting claims out there, but even this simple thing slipped under their radar. Oh and it's not on one page only.
/technologies/hub/si3n4.php - claim that Si3N4 is higher quality than other ceramic bearings, claim to use Grade 2 balls on ABEC7 races (then later on the same page reducing that to ABEC5) and claiming 2 watts over steel bearings

they exhibit variance in size and sphericity of LESS than 2 millionths of an inch among the entire bearing set... The bearing races themselves are a hybrid ceramic specific alloy finely ground and polished to a ABEC7 standard and cryogenically treated at -300 degrees Fahrenheit to refine the molecular structure... Each ball is over 1000X more round than the best steel bearing of any type, grade or benchmark... These should absolutely not be confused with the ceramic bearings flooding the market from China and India, many of which use ball and race tolerances equal to or worse than high precision steel bearings. The standard Zipp steel bearing uses a Grade 10 ball (the Ceramics use a Grade 2, the finest available) and ABEC5 races, while most other ceramics on the market are using Grade 25 balls with an ABEC1 or ABEC3 race making them actually less efficient than the standard Zipp Ultra-Precision Steel Bearings.

All of this is patently false. No manufacturer makes Grade 25 ceramic balls. Grade 25 is a standard for steel balls. Of the information on that page, 80% of it is flat out wrong and deceptive. Oh and for the record, 3 millionths of an inch is not 1000X more round than the best steel bearings (6 millionths - Grade 6) or even than their own steel bearings (10 millionths - Grade 10) or even than Shimano's Grade 25 (25 millionths)balls.

/wheels/hubs/88-188-hubs/ - claim Grade 10 steel balls with ABEC7 races (nonsense), repeat statement about 2 millionths and Grade 2.

/technologies/hub/88-188-hubs.php - similar content, but not the same. Grade 10 steel balls in ABEC7 races, etc

/technologies/hub/hub.php - main page for technologies, the second section is this:

SI3N4 Ceramic Bearings
For years, we've been the only hub manufacturer using Swiss-made bearings that are two and a half times rounder than any others in the bike industry - rounder even than many ceramic bearings. But for the 88 and 188, we added adjustable preload and switched to a slightly larger size that gives us room for a 17mm diameter axle, the stiffest in any road hub. The new bearings also yield a 28% higher load capacity, improve durability, and will save you a watt or two relative to the competition, regardless of conditions. If you upgrade to Si3N4 Ceramic Bearings, know that you'll be getting Grade 2 balls, the finest available, with tolerances less than 2 millionths of an inch per set of 15 bearings.

Information that was never true and hasn't been written faithfully at all. Literally almost everything they have written about their bearings is either impossible, wrong or even contradicted by other information on the same page.

So why is anything else on their website trustworthy?

I haven't fact checked everything else on their site and I have no interest to do so. But I checked this much and it's ridiculous. Have you checked any of their other statements? Clearly people are making the decision to buy their wheels based on something. Maybe it's just because top Pro's are paid to use these wheels. I guess you can't expect wise buying decisions out of people like that, but that can't be everybody... can it?

[PLuKE]

This is great post. I have learnt a lot regarding bearings with many problems of two Camag wheel sets I have owned.

I am looking at buying the 2016 FC404 with the 77/177 hubs. They state " Zipp is the only company specifying Swiss made highly specialized ball bearing cartridges. Working with a family owned Swiss bearing manufacturer, Zipp is able to attain a superior level of bearing smoothness and long life. Zips ball bearings are specified to 10 millionths of an inch tolerance, guaranteeing that they are at least 2.5 times rounder and better matched than most company’s “high precision” balls, and more than five times tighter than most “precision” balls. "

SO is that true? or are they talking about there NSW/Firestrike wheels?

Will the Zipp bearings roll better than Campag Bora USB bearings??

[goodboyr]

You won't be able to tell the difference.