Best all round wheelset

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sawyer
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Location: Natovi Landing

by sawyer

bonafide wrote:All...I really like the Bora's and Shamals but would like to add a PT (wheel based preferred) and I know of no way to do that.....?


Not possible I'm afraid ... G3 spoking, and in the case of Shamals the spoke type, make it impossible

TBH I would regard it as criminal to dismantle a perfectly functional set of either!

If you want a PT wheel then FFWD are a good starting point ... I've done that with F4R tubs ... Or alternatively, for a bit more money, Zipps
----------------------------------------
Stiff, Light, Aero - Pick Three!! :thumbup:

fromtrektocolnago
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Joined: Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:15 pm

by fromtrektocolnago

trailflow1 wrote:
fromtrektocolnago wrote:I put the Dura Ace C24 as best all around wheel set. They're light, climb well, cost under $1000, have great braking courtesy of the bonded metal strip and because they aren't deep handle cross-winds. They are moderately aero as well. I could not be more pleased since purchasing.


Dura Ace C24 rims are made from alloy with a carbon layer bonded to the rim.
Image

They are soft rims and tend to wear down fairly quickly IME.


I will certainly watch out for that and that is a concern, but so far 10,000 miles and going strong.
Colnago C-59 (Dura Ace)
Firefly(Ultegra)
Colnago C-64 disc(ultegra) with Bora 35 wheels

by Weenie


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eaglejackson
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by eaglejackson

Flip around the front. I had the same problem (7900) and mechanic said it was common. Once it was flipped, no pulsing/vibration.


Thanks for the tip. I'll try that if the problem returns.

dalex
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 12:05 pm

by dalex

UpFromOne wrote:Gotta put in a plug for AX-Lightness rims. I've built wheels most of my adult life, and these rims are incredible. Puts classic Edge/Enve rims to shame on the stiffness to weight factor (i say that as the newer Enve designs are admittedly stiffer). And just about the lightest weights ever for each size. Not too many would consider these for everyday wheels, but they really are durable regardless of hub choice (i've used half a dozen hub brands on these rims). Prices do vary alot around the world.


How is the braking on the AX-Lightness rims? I'm considering a pair of wheels with the 24 mm tubular rim for use in the mountains, so braking under dry and wet conditions is important.

LiteAgilis
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by LiteAgilis

I've never had more success than w Shamal Ultra's. They've never been trued, never dented and I've gone over some pretty offensive potholes. Hubs are smooth as silk w easy maintenance (something that seems rare these days). I'd buy another Campy wheelset before anything else.

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itsacarr
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by itsacarr

I love the c24's - I just keep hoping they will update them to be wide. But they have been a very solid all around wheel set for the non carbon clincher or deep wheel.
Just ride ..

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mythical
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by mythical

ergott wrote:Just look for the following attributes.

1) at least a semi aero profile
2) availability of parts for service (I hate the concept of disposable wheels).
3) hubs that can be serviced and don't require a lot of maintenance.
Sensible criteria indeed. I'd go for wheels that give the best response for what we throw at it. So preferably with wider rims or tubulars, (semi-) aero profile or not. And well-engineered hubs. So many manufacturers change their hub designs year after year, it makes one wonder if the previous version wasn't good enough in the first place.

Generally, most wheels are repairable, these days even wheels with full carbon rims. I think this issue is more a matter of repair fees, often proportionate to the cost of the wheels, and how much the owner is willing to pony up.

ergott wrote:Things to avoid

1) wheels that you can't find replacement rims for (face it, damage happens).
2) hubs that don't need constant attention to bearings or adjustment.
Are we talking about e.g. light one-piece carbon wheels predominantly aimed at race participation? Or generally anything light and too fidgety, or hubs not engineered for easy of maintenance?

ergott wrote:Mavic is love/hate with some swearing by them, but there are enough people out there that are annoyed by the hubs.

I think it's irresponsible to use wheels that require replacing the entire wheel if you damage a rim. With great wheels, you can wear out the rims after 10s of thousands of miles and rebuild them.
I once damaged the rear rim of one of the earlier tubular Ksyrium wheels, due to wear really. After many years of use, one of the threads in the rim was damaged, rendering the entire wheel useless. One spoke broke and I ordered new spokes and a new rim, rebuilt it to put it back in working order. I got rid of the wheels after that, never to ride another Mavic wheel again.

ergott wrote:
sawyer wrote:
In what sense irresponsible?


Wear out brake track or damage it hitting something, throw out wheel.

Not cool.

Wear out brake track or damage it hitting something, order replacement rim and rebuilt.

Cool.

It's a feature not limited to custom wheels. Hubs can have a far longer lifespan than one rim.
My wishlist for a an ideal allround wheel include:

Hubs that:
- have high as possible flanges with a wide as possible spacing for an even spoke tension between drive side and non-drive side
- are as light as possible with a big diameter axle or really wide bearings spacing
- have a high bearing load capacity
- feature a bearing preload mechanism, for bearing lifespan
- are easily serviced and pulled apart, without requiring (expensive) specialty tooling
- ideally, allow triplet lacing

Spokes that:
- are light, like <4 grams per spoke
- can take a high tension of >130kgf
- don't twist excessively when truing
- are easy to replace when damaged
- can be replaced by an easy to find alternative

Rims that:
- are aero enough but not necessarily the most aero (since rider position has a bigger impact on air resistance)
- are sturdy, perhaps around 400-450g for alloy or lighter for carbon, no thin sidewalls
- are stiff enough to work with a low spoke count
- are wider, which often results in better stiffness, lower spoke count and increased tire volume with lower pressure for better grip and lower rolling resistance
- if not disc-only, have a wear-resistant brake track, e.g. coated with Keronite like Mavic wheels with Exalith or Fulcrum Zero Nite/Campagnolo Shamal Mille

And if this wheelset could be around 1100-1200 grams without cassette, skewers and tires, that would be fabulous!
“I always find it amazing that a material can actually sell a product when it’s really the engineering that creates and dictates how well that material will behave or perform.” — Chuck Teixeira

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ergott
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by ergott

That's a nice summation right there.

octav
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by octav

Just bought a set of Zonda for Campy, 1508 grams real weight. I am really really delighted with them ;)

Marin
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by Marin

mythical wrote:Hubs that:
- have high as possible flanges with a wide as possible spacing for an even spoke tension between drive side and non-drive side


As I understand it, with a wide rear spacing you will have maximum tension ineqality unless you go 2:1 lacing.

The best geometries will have a high DS and a low NDS flange and will have the NDS flange moved _in_ quite far to even out the tension.

Offset rear rims help a lot.

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mythical
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by mythical

Exactly. I quite like the idea of either an asymmetric rim or triplet lacing to even out spoke tension, and anything that increases bracing angle.
“I always find it amazing that a material can actually sell a product when it’s really the engineering that creates and dictates how well that material will behave or perform.” — Chuck Teixeira

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Dr.Dos
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by Dr.Dos

Fulcrum Racing Quattro 2016 in either material are awesome. The first true wide profile from the big 3 (4), top build quality as always.

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ergott
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by ergott

People overstate the importance of even spoke balance between the two sides. Sufficient tension to prevent spokes from going slack is important, not 50/50 tension.

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mai
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by mai

dalex wrote:
UpFromOne wrote:Gotta put in a plug for AX-Lightness rims. I've built wheels most of my adult life, and these rims are incredible. Puts classic Edge/Enve rims to shame on the stiffness to weight factor (i say that as the newer Enve designs are admittedly stiffer). And just about the lightest weights ever for each size. Not too many would consider these for everyday wheels, but they really are durable regardless of hub choice (i've used half a dozen hub brands on these rims). Prices do vary alot around the world.


How is the braking on the AX-Lightness rims? I'm considering a pair of wheels with the 24 mm tubular rim for use in the mountains, so braking under dry and wet conditions is important.



they are excellent. they are closest to alu braking i've ever got from full carbon wheelsets - much better than the enve 6.7s and giant rims that i have.

by Weenie


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sjdong
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Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2016 3:20 pm

by sjdong

Campagnolo Bora one. cost & performance very Cool.

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