Di2 setup damaged in crash, what to look for?

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OhPinchy
Posts: 80
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:38 pm

by OhPinchy

I came down in a crash in a race yesterday. Wasn't too bad, I've bumps and bruises but managed to come down sideways, kind of a 45 degree angle, so no major direct impact to me or the bike. It's a Cannondale SuperSix Evo Hi Mod running Dura Ace Di2. I picked the bike up, pedals seemed to turn ok, so I jumped on and chased back onto the bunch. Only then realised the derailleurs wouldn't shift and I was stuck in 53x11 for the lonely 40km route home. And I'd lost my Garmin Edge 500 to boot.

The right shifter is scraped, has a couple of chips out of it, and it's bent/moved inwards, and there's a cut on the bar tape but I don't think any cables were cut. Rear derailleur definitely took some impact as the chain was tangled, but after loosening that out, it seemed ok. When I tried shifting front derailleur into little ring, it worked, but it never liked being in the 34x11 gear (wonder if that's due to chain length?) and so the chain kept falling off on the inside. So I kept it in 53x11 all the way home and there was a tickety-tick noise from the the chainring/derailleur area when pedalling, and the rear derailleur would make that click-click noise like it was trying to shift but couldn't.

The frame looks ok, initial glance showed no scrapes or signs of impact. Will double-check it. I usually do most of the work on my bike though I felt this time I'd bring it to the LBS to get it properly taken care of. Rang them and they have an event on so couldn't get it back to me until end of next week, and getting out of work to an LBS further afield will be a challenge for me, so I'd like to try get it working myself.

I'll check if the rear derailleur hanger was bent or not, and have ordered one anyway, as it's good to have one on-hand for quick repair if needed. I'm guessing I take both the rear and front derailleurs off the bike and then basically follow YouTube videos as if I was installing them from new? Or is there any way to put it into recalibration mode first to see if a reset will get it back working?

Not sure about the shifter - use brute force to move it back, or take the bar tape off and refit it (guessing there is a bolt to be undone, reposition shifter, reset bolt)? Any tips to help get my steed back on the road in time for this weekend's racing are much appreciated!

amb001
Posts: 34
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2015 9:45 pm
Location: Essex,UK

by amb001

It's possible your rear derailleur has gone into crash protection mode. According to the shimano guide this is how to clear it:-

http://si.shimano.com/php/download.php?file=pdf/um/UM-5XW0B-001-00-ENG.pdf

* Rotate the front chainwheel while restoring operation after the protection function has been activated.
If the bicycle receives a strong impact, the protection function operates and the connection between the motor and the link is momentarily severed so that the rear derailleur will no longer operate. If this happens, press the information display mode button or the button on junction (A) for 5 seconds or more. This will restore the connection between the motor and the link and clear the protection function for the rear derailleur. If recovery cannot be performed through button operation, manual operation is also possible. Consult with a distributor in advance

by Weenie


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OhPinchy
Posts: 80
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:38 pm

by OhPinchy

Thanks a lot for that suggestion - wasn't aware of such a crash protection feature, will definitely check if that resolves it.

glepore
Posts: 1408
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:42 pm
Location: Virginia USA

by glepore

I'd also make sure your wiring is still connected to front shifter.
Cysco Ti custom Campy SR mechanical (6.9);Berk custom (5.6); Serotta Ottrott(6.8) ; Anvil Custom steel Etap;1996 Colnago Technos Record

wingguy
Posts: 4318
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:43 pm

by wingguy

OhPinchy wrote:Not sure about the shifter - use brute force to move it back, or take the bar tape off and refit it (guessing there is a bolt to be undone, reposition shifter, reset bolt)?


You don't need to take bar tape off to reposition the shifter horizontally - the bolt that tightens the clamp is under the hood. Peel it back and there's an obvious 5mm hex bolt in there.

OhPinchy
Posts: 80
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:38 pm

by OhPinchy

Thanks folks for those pointers - much appreciated. I wasn't familiar with where the bolt is that tightens the shifter, that's good news that I can get at it without moving the bar tape. Just need to get a chance to get out of work at a reasonable hour and have a chance to look at it properly. Will start by repositioning the shifter, checking all the Di2 cable connections, checking the drivetrain is generally clear and looks reasonably aligned, and then clear the crash protection mode. Will either be late tonight or tomorrow night that I get a chance to look at it, so your advice really helps me plan ahead for what to do. Much appreciated.

glepore
Posts: 1408
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:42 pm
Location: Virginia USA

by glepore

Actually I meant the right brifter, I wasn't thinking. When the lever moves on the bars it often pulls the connector out of the brifter.
Cysco Ti custom Campy SR mechanical (6.9);Berk custom (5.6); Serotta Ottrott(6.8) ; Anvil Custom steel Etap;1996 Colnago Technos Record

OhPinchy
Posts: 80
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:38 pm

by OhPinchy

So the good news first: I inspected the frame and there is not a scratch on it, seems it survived unscathed. I was able to move the right brifter back into position and secure it and remove and reinsert the Di2 cable to ensure a good connection. The front derailleur had been moved out of position but not damaged - removed it and reinstalled and it seems to be working perfectly.

Bad news: I think the rear derailleur is screwed. The cage is bent and has a crack in it, and it looks misaligned so the chain slips off the jockey wheel and pushes the cage out. The derailleur itself is scraped, but the main problem is it's just not moving, when trying a gear change, it makes a grinding electronic noise repeatedly but doesn't move. The right brifter is also scraped and the buttons felt a little loose at first, but I'm now thinking it's ok. I've uploaded some pics here: http://1drv.ms/1K4wP4L

I connected to a PC via USB connection into the SM-BCR2 port I hooked up to the Junction A 3-port box and ran the etube software. It recognised all components successfully and it updated the firmware on several components. Trying to change gears via the software did get the RD making some noise, but not really moving properly. I tried swapping the buttons around between the left and right brifters, but even when using the left brifter, there was no movement in the RD. When I hold down either shifter button on the right brifter, the battery indicator on the Junction A box does illuminate, which suggests to me that the shifter and buttons is working.

At this point, I think I need to replace the rear derailleur, and hopefully I don't have to replace the right brifter (can you buy those as singles or just in pairs?). I dropped my winter bike down to a local bike shop that is a low key outfit, just one guy but he knows what he's at. Intent is to get that bike fully serviced and ready to get me back racing tomorrow night, and he says he'll get it done in time, which is a big help as I'm short on time.

Once that's done, fixing my Cannondale is less time sensitive as I'll at least be back on the road. I've have a new rear derailleur hanger from Cannondale en route and we agreed that it'll be best that I go and buy a new RD (his supplier lead times can take a while) and hanger and then he'll sort it out.

So I need to make a call on what RD to buy. Nasty surprise to see the DuraAce Di2 rear derailleur is pricier than expected, cheapest I've seen it is 470 euro. Ultegra Di2 RD is 155 euro. Some difference! And reading up online suggests that I can use an Ultegra Di2 RD with the rest of my DuraAce Di2 components without issue. Advantage of Ultegra is that there are medium and short cage options. I'll be hitting the Mortirolo, Stelvio, Gavia etc. this summer so ability to put on an 11-30 would be handy. If the only downside of the medium cage is a few extra grams of weight and otherwise it functions as well as the short cage, I'll go with that.

So hopefully I don't need to go with a new DuraAce RD and a new right brifter, which would cost about 1,000 euro in total by the looks of it. If I could get out of jail for 155euro I would be delighted (and a fellow racer found my Garmin Edge lost in the crash and is returning it to me so happy days!). Yep, I'd prefer to keep full DuraAce on the bike, but given I'll be racing it again, the cheaper Ultegra option is a good trade-off.

djwalker
Posts: 165
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2009 7:35 pm

by djwalker

You can use an Ultegra RD with everything else being DuraAce and it will work perfectly well. See the compatibility chart at http://e-tubeproject.shimano.com/pdf/20150320_compatibility_chart_en.pdf . I have the medium cage Ultegra RD as it shifts perfectly fine on smaller cassettes it just has the ability to use a large cassette as well. I have my chain and derailleur adjustment set up for a 32 tooth cog but normally run a 25 or 28 and I can switch back and forth without adjusting anything.

OhPinchy
Posts: 80
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:38 pm

by OhPinchy

djwalker wrote:You can use an Ultegra RD with everything else being DuraAce and it will work perfectly well. See the compatibility chart at http://e-tubeproject.shimano.com/pdf/20150320_compatibility_chart_en.pdf . I have the medium cage Ultegra RD as it shifts perfectly fine on smaller cassettes it just has the ability to use a large cassette as well. I have my chain and derailleur adjustment set up for a 32 tooth cog but normally run a 25 or 28 and I can switch back and forth without adjusting anything.


Thanks a lot djwalker, very reassuring to hear from someone actually using this setup, particularly the ability to swap in 25 or 28 tooth cassettes without issue.

ross
Posts: 393
Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2011 10:59 am
Location: Oxfordshire UK

by ross

If it's any help you can buy new cage and all the components from SJS cycles

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/gear-spares- ... pt994_pg1/

Get all the part numbers from the Shimano exploded diagrams - download the EV type diagrams from http://si.shimano.com/#

Raineman
Posts: 185
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 2:03 pm
Location: Kent, UK

by Raineman

Did you try taking the RD out of crash protection mode?

It looks like your RD hanger is bent which explains the alignment. If the cage is screwed though you could replace it with a long cage to allow lower gears (not sure but you might be able to salvage one from a ultegra or 105 gs mech).

OhPinchy
Posts: 80
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:38 pm

by OhPinchy

Thanks. Yes, did press the button on the Junction A box for 5 seconds until the red light disappeared to take it out of crash protection mode. Yeh the cage is definitely damaged, and the hanger does look bent. Will replace the hanger with the new one that is on the way. I've gone ahead and ordered the Ultegra GS rear derailleur to get me back on the road in the shortest time possible. If it's possible to salvage the Dura Ace RD in a cost effective manner, I'll do that and either have it on hand as a ready-to-go spare, or use the Ultegra one as a spare to minimise turnaround time from any future damage. But the prices for the spare parts on the SJS site is frightening - looks like replacing the cage alone could exceed the cost of the Ultegra RD.

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