Campy 2015 downshifting problems

[michaelemberley]

I've just installed new 2015 Chorus ergo shifters + new 2015 front and rear deraillers.

Everything shifts fine, but - the right downshift thumb paddle "catches" slightly when downshifting in the middle 5 cogs.
The large and small cog down shifts are OK. Up shifting is OK. Left shifter is OK. Cables are not routed tightly. All housing and cables are new and smooth. Cable tension does not seem to affect it. I know Campy shifters are stiff when new but this is different.

Everything works, but it's annoying. having a look inside as it's shifting, it looks like the ratchet wheel is not moving the exact same amount for each shift. It's hard to describe, but here goes - in the middle range, the thumb-shifter "hook" is just "catching" the very edge of a cog tooth below before it engages - slipping over it - causing a, "ka-click" feeling in those middle 5 downshifts, instead of a simple, precise, "click".

Any tips/ideas/help appreciated. You just want Campy to be right.

[ITTY]

Maybe you just got a shifter with a "bad" ratchet mechanism. Whoever you bought it from should be able to replace it.

[jimborello]

Im having the exact same problem and it has become really annoying. Until now I was blaming my mechanic but it might be a warranty issue.

[bikerjulio]

If anyone can shed some light on this its Graeme at Velotech who posts here sometimes.

http://www.velotech-cycling.ltd.uk/campagnolo.shtml

There was a change to the pull amount per click with 2015, but that could have been done simply by reducing the diameter of the spool, leaving the rest of the mechanism the same as before.

Other than making sure that the thumb shifter is moving freely, I don't have any ideas, other than it's possibly faulty.

ps. found his info

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=8882

[michaelemberley]

Yes, it may be a warranty issue... but taking it off, sending it back, waiting, reinstalling a new one, just to find out it happens again - no way.

Maybe it's the same for all of them... Better I suppose to wait for more time and more people to actually use the stuff. Find out if mine is just one of a few...

Campy should respond. I tried. But they told me to "contact a specialist in my country." Ireland, where I live, has no local Campy expert. But they would need to have a notice from Campy anyway to do anything but replace the shifter. It does work. Just not like an expensive Campy part should...

BTW. Other 2015 Campy things I learned:

The 2015 R. derailler has "new geometry" to stay closer to the cogs. The tension screw for the cage has LOTS of adjustment. I had to screw it all the way in to get it as close as they ask for. Lots of turns. Just keep going... Fine when you get it there.

The limit screws on the R der. are teeny, tiny allen bolts this time. The "manual" says only a professional mechanic should touch them... :0) I found them way off and needed lots of turns to get right. But fine when there.

Front der. has no instruction as to exactly how to attach the cable. I found it better to attach it OVER the little tab, not under it. I saw it attached like that on a video online, although it still didn't mention it. It was shifting a bit harder the other way. The cable was also just touching the der. when on small ring, but not when I changed the mounting. They make a little thingy to add on if your frame cable route makes the cable hit the der. (not included, of course)

Both F and R shifting is stiff - Campy can be like that when new. But front shifting is still quite heavy, despite the longer, Shimano-like lever. I like a bit heavier shifting so I don't mind.

And front der. must be set up carefully. They have a special tool to make it easy but it's not included of course... Just do as they say...

FYI - I used a sep F. der. clamp - and the Campy clamp IS different from a generic one, despite what the shop tried to tell me. The mounting point is much further forward and affects the shifting. The other one will work, but it works better with a clamp like Campy's with a more forward mounting point. The ordinary one has a mounting point in line with the center of the seat tube, the Campy one has a mounting point aligned with the front of the seat tube. Others like SRAM or Shimano may be similar, I don't know.

[michaelemberley]

Thanks "Bikerjulio".

I did send them a message. No response yet. They are in the UK and I bought the parts in the UK so maybe I can get some help there.

[jimborello]

I changed cables from Aican to Campagnolo and the shifting improved a little, but it is not what I was used to (Campy SR 80 anniversary). I had in order a second groupset so I will install it on my other bike and I will report back

[michaelemberley]

Campy Velotech UK have offered to look at it if I mail it to them. But I have taken the shifter off and it seems to shift OK disconnected, (Not great but OK) so sending it back would likely prompt them to say nothing's wrong. But the downshifting ratchet is simply not lined up right. When I put it back on and attached the cable it still does, just on 4 shifts - 9, 8, 7, 6.

There is no actual back stop for Campy thumbshifters (downshift) when you release them - they just top out on the lever body. But this aligns them for the each shift. So I tried putting a little piece of tape in there so the thumb shifter would not come up all the way, and voila, it works! But this is a Gumby fix. It should line up on it's own. Bad tolerances?

[bikerjulio]

Mail it to them, since I for one want to know what they have to say.

[HTML]

Before sending it off. Try re-lubing the mechanism wih spray grease/oil.

[synthesis]

Before sending it off. Try re-lubing the mechanism wih spray grease/oil.

I always use Sram Jonnisnot or SP41 From Shimano made for skifters and cables, takes up to 30% friction out of the shift.

[knef]

Sure the hood rubber is seated properly? I don't know the new models. But we had some isues with clients changing bartape and not putting back the hoods correctly. Resulting in extra friction between rubber hood and paddle.

[michaelemberley]

The mechanism is new, it should not need lube. But worth a try. It would be in the thumbshifter somewhere.

It's not a rubber hood fitting issue. But it might be a spring issue

Having a look at previous 11 speed I have, the 2015 is all new parts. At least different finish. A chrome thumbshift hook instead of black, a silver ratchet cog instead of a "bronze" color. And the secondary spring in the thumbshifter, the "waggle" movement before it starts to turn, is softer in the 2015. That could be enough to make the difference in where it lands on the teeth below.

Hard to know what parts actually changed though beyond the indexing parts. You can't find a blow apart diagram of 2015 ergo as the parts are not individually sold anymore. Just an entire "lever assembly" without hood, bar clamp, or brake lever.

I tried again all sorts of adjustments to no effect. It's in the ratchet mechanism. It does work off the bike, but cable tension is just enough to make that tiny misalignment on the middle 4 shifts, and just slip off the edge of the tooth below before engaging. Maddening!

Campy shifters are surprisingly crude when you really examine them. I've rebuilt a few of mine. Not exactly "clockwork". There is a lot of flex and lateral movement. Normal, but it could easily make for operating errors if manufacturing tolerances were off. I know, this does not sound like Campy, but no one's perfect. And these are first year products no matter how long pro teams have beta tested them.

For now, so I don't have to sit at home not riding while I wait for a possible warranty fix that may not happen. I will leave the tiny bit of tape in there as they work now...order a new right shifter (I have a almost new left shifter left over from a crash). when it gets here I'll swap and send out the others for an opinion.

2015 Campy mechanical shifting is stiff and loud no matter what. Looks like they are going in the opposite direction of Shimano. But EPS shifting is reportedly so good (never tried it myself) it may not be something either company spends to much more RD on. I like stiff mechanical shifting - as long as it works.

Haven't heard much feedback about issues from 2015 users, the stuff is so new. But what I can find sounds like more to do with front shifting issues.

[bikerjulio]

That's 2 people on this thread, and there's a couple more over on RBR.

see post #14 http://forums.roadbikereview.com/components-wrenching/campy-over-torque-2015-4-arm-344729.html

Can't find the other comment right now, but it was similar

[michaelemberley]

For reasons of ease of use, and access from the drops etc, Campy has changed the 2015 Athena 11 thumbshifter, to a droopy looking, "EPS style" thumb lever rather than the triangular button sticking straight out.
I use Centaur Powershift on one bike and it works great. The downshifting is very precise. Click, click, click. You just don't get to down shift more than one cog at a time - al la Shim/Sram. It's a much simpler mechanism inside. Makes me wonder if I should get Athena shifters instead... though these new shifters are for the old deraillers only I believe... so I'd have to change back to a pre 2015 derailler. Why change the shifter and not the... ah, next year I bet.