The Parlee tall is out of place here (I exclude endurance geometry, for example, of other companies) but I included it just for comparison.
stack-reach comparison of 2014-2015 road frames
Moderator: robbosmans
Some stack-reach comparison charts for 2014-2015 road frames. I also include 2008 Cervelo R-series geometry. I have Cervelo R5 and Trek Madone on both of the plots for reference. Dotted lines show effect of more spacers (higher stack, slightly shorter reach) or a longer 0-degree stem (longer reach, slightly higher stack).
The Parlee tall is out of place here (I exclude endurance geometry, for example, of other companies) but I included it just for comparison.
The Parlee tall is out of place here (I exclude endurance geometry, for example, of other companies) but I included it just for comparison.
Nice chart, DJ. I'm a Cervelo fan and it shows how the stack-reach geometry is applied... very nice. I'm not an engineer or anything, but the linear evolution of the frames seems logical. The differences should be the slopes, and then every cyclist could find his very own optimal frame.
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I really like the way Trek handles it. Here's the Trek Madone H1 and H2 curves compared with Cervelo old and new
That's basically 15 sizes for one bike.
I also add in the Domane sizes. The Domane Race looks like a very attractive bike. It would take around 8 cm of spacers to bring the Race up to a slammed standard Domane. The normal Domane is a stackfest.
That's basically 15 sizes for one bike.
I also add in the Domane sizes. The Domane Race looks like a very attractive bike. It would take around 8 cm of spacers to bring the Race up to a slammed standard Domane. The normal Domane is a stackfest.
Last edited by djconnel on Mon Aug 18, 2014 4:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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dudemanppl
- Posts: 1266
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Could you add Specialized?
Edit: My eyes have deceived me....
Edit: My eyes have deceived me....
More Specialized. The Venge is basically identical to the Tarmac. The Roubaix is fairly close to the Trek Madone H2, not nearly as relaxed as the Roubaix: around 2.5 cm spacer difference. The Madone H1 is more aggressive than the Tarmac, however: with two lines of Madone they can afford to be more aggressive on the longer/lower version.
Last edited by djconnel on Wed Aug 20, 2014 2:15 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Thanks! Accidentally modified "all axes" on xmgrace, creating a mess. I fixed it.
Using slowtwitch.com stack & reach database and something like Tableu Public could generate some interesting "live" visualizations
That's an interesting idea! Need a web server with gnuplot.
Storck is well known to be a bit weird on geometry, so I decided to plot it versus Canyon, a perennial rival in Tour magazine.
I previously plotted the Canyon AeroRoad. Here I add the ultimate. For once a bike company does the obvious which is to make the aero bike lower. And the longest Ultimate is incredibly long. It must be those tall Norwegian customers.
But the Storck 0.6 is a bit bizarre. The smallest size differs only in stem length, essentially (actually with the head tube angle being slacker than 73 deg, slammed stem will result in the smallest being slightly higher). Then after that "constant bar height" move, it goes constant reach (straight up). The Aernario is basically the same with the addition of a larger size with longer reach & stack.
Storck is well known to be a bit weird on geometry, so I decided to plot it versus Canyon, a perennial rival in Tour magazine.
I previously plotted the Canyon AeroRoad. Here I add the ultimate. For once a bike company does the obvious which is to make the aero bike lower. And the longest Ultimate is incredibly long. It must be those tall Norwegian customers.
But the Storck 0.6 is a bit bizarre. The smallest size differs only in stem length, essentially (actually with the head tube angle being slacker than 73 deg, slammed stem will result in the smallest being slightly higher). Then after that "constant bar height" move, it goes constant reach (straight up). The Aernario is basically the same with the addition of a larger size with longer reach & stack.
One thing people always forget is headset stack. Cannondale uses either a 25mm or a flat headset cap. The Speci cap measures 11mm. The Trek caps measure 15 to 18mm depending on the frame. The Venge HT does not include the integrated headset cap.
Just curious- what is the "Madone race"? Is that the Koppenberg model (Emonda geo), the classics model, or the H1 model? Unfortunately the classics edition only comes in a complete build and the Koppenberg is a ways out.
Just curious- what is the "Madone race"? Is that the Koppenberg model (Emonda geo), the classics model, or the H1 model? Unfortunately the classics edition only comes in a complete build and the Koppenberg is a ways out.
I wondered the same thing. I saw the head tube length of the "Domane Classics Edition" and thought "this chart is either completely wrong or this is the perfect bike for me"
The Domane Race is the Domane sold to satisfy the UCI so that the bike can be provided to the professional riders, who obviously aren't going to ride the standard Domane.
The Emonda H2 is the same essentially as the Madone H2. The Emonda H1 is almost 2 cm more stack than the Madone H1, still well shorter than the H2, but not as aggressive as Madone.
The headset cap is easily replaced though, right? Does the stock cap affect stack & reach?
The Emonda H2 is the same essentially as the Madone H2. The Emonda H1 is almost 2 cm more stack than the Madone H1, still well shorter than the H2, but not as aggressive as Madone.
The headset cap is easily replaced though, right? Does the stock cap affect stack & reach?
I added Emonda H1 to the 2nd previous plot. Emonda H2, not available on the top bike build apparently, is the same essentially as the Madone H2. Note the Emonda H1 is around 1 cm less aggressive than the Madone H1, but still lower than the Tarmac.
More bikes. I realize the 54 cm (3rd smallest) RCa (R5) would actually work for me with a -17 deg 10 cm stem. The bike's geometry certainly is strange.
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djconnel wrote:The Domane Race is the Domane sold to satisfy the UCI so that the bike can be provided to the professional riders, who obviously aren't going to ride the standard Domane.
The Emonda H2 is the same essentially as the Madone H2. The Emonda H1 is almost 2 cm more stack than the Madone H1, still well shorter than the H2, but not as aggressive as Madone.
The headset cap is easily replaced though, right? Does the stock cap affect stack & reach?
It will just affect stack and from what I know it is just a Cane Creek cap so you could presumably find a replacement, however, you have to assume that most won't/can't.
