Ciamillo is Restructuring

[boysa]

A while back, when someone posted a "warning" to others about a company called Edco, it turned out to be entirely misleading. The entire thread was a farce. I asked for the thread to be deleted, since I felt it was unnecessarily slighting the company, and here was the response:

As for deleting this thread, yes we can, but we won't. If we would do that the forum would be create the situation that these discussions can't being 're-read'.

Seems that would apply here, no?

+1K Andy2.

[Transparent]

To the moderators, Juanmoretime and Tinea Pedis specifically.

We have been watching this thread and the others on this forum related to Ciamillo for some time with growing concern. While we have remained silent until now, we believe the time has come to call a spade a spade. The big issue is not Ciamillo, his products or his business practices. The real issue pertains to the moderators on this forum.

For the forum to function properly, it needs to have a modicum of integrity. Moderators of any forum acting as shills for any product or manufacturer, flaunting the relationship in photos posted in threads on said forum, and actively promoting a product is questionable at best. However, when the moderators then choose to censor, delete, or remove any post or thread that raises valid questions about said product or the business practices of their pet manufacturer, they undermine the very credibility that makes a forum worthwhile.

Again, we are not addressing the issue of Ciamillo nor are we making any value judgements on the situation relating to him. The actions of the moderators on this forum, Juanmoretime and Tinea Pedis specifically, directly challenge the notion that this forum is a place of open, active and informed debate. That a side effect of their position is to alienate and undermine bicycle industry dealers is all the more puzzling but only begs more questions about their agenda.

The moderators now have a choice. If you choose to remove this post, and/or continue to delete posts you do not like, your answer will be resoundingly clear. We, like a number of others, will choose to cease participating in the forum with great disappointment.

P.A. Annerstedt
Adam Wais

Rolobikes
Luxembourg/Sweden

Adam, you are entitled to express your opinion and as far as I know do not have another agenda. Two posts were removed from this thead one that does have another agenda and that was a brand new member with only a post here support our "pet". I guess we should put that one back.

You can question my personal support of products that do work and I trust my life to on a daily basis. Kind of what everyone does here. Anyone here that would like to see exactly what I ride PM me and come to Central Illinois and ride with me and my team. Verses others here I have had bad experiences with products and choose not to start threads bashing the manufacturer in a negative way. My expression of opinion of Ted relate only to my own personal experiences. I'm sorry if I have had a good experience with product Ted has designed and manufactured. There was a time when Ciamillo had outstanding customer service. I admittedly was ham fisted when installing my first set of zero Gravity brakes and broke a cinch bolt. Ted at no charge overnighted some spares. This was so during a time when Ted did do this for everyone. Search, it's out there. This site started for everyone to share knowledge of light bikes. Custom made modifications, parts fabricated and of products that appealed in our quest to make our bikes lighter.

You will also notice I seldom post pictures of anything weight weenie items that I purchase for the past few years because I just rather ride it and enjoy. You will so find as of lately threads started by me as of the past few years are to try to tap in to the technical knowledge of the forum members. I have much greater interest in aerodynamics as a time trialist.

You can personal acuse me of being a shill but I really have nothing to personally gain. Other than having spoke to Ted Ciamillo on the phone and by email we have never met so I could not even say that he's a friend. I can be a big arrogant and opiniated and that seems to be just like any here.


I could go on and on but will stop here with my final comments.

There are many unflattering posts that are still on here and not removed, one of the two removed was a supported. Your post is still standing since we repect your entitle to opinion and there is no hidden agenda behind. Also this thread could have been locked or just pulled and even with Ted's opening statement is not very flattering. Sounds like he saw his sucked and admitting his flaws of running a business and wants to turn it around. My opinion only.

We are all cyclist with greater knowledge than average cyclist and such a small group it's very disheartening to see such bickering and name calling. Are we not above RBR?

No, you are worse than RBR because they at least have the stones to clear the air and let both sides of the story unfold.

Is your post supposed to make any sense at all?

No one cares what you ride, no one cares what brakes you like and no one cares about your personal experience from yesteryear on a bolt when there are literally dozens of people who Ted owes product, warranty and money to.

You seem to be incapable of answering pretty specific questions?

You allow only positive comments when in fact Ted still owes customers and "dealers" and has outstanding warranty issues that have taken over a year and are still unresolved.

You continue to waste your time banning IP addresses and forum members that would bring that information to light.

The question is, why?

You will gain more respect by staying out of it, really.

[Tinea Pedis]

You will gain more respect by staying out of it, really.

And let the other side of the story come out? Which really is no ones business except for between yourself and Ted? No. This thread has seen enough mud thrown and certainly enough ineloquent warnings for people who might want to purchase through Ted.

No one cares what you ride, no one cares what brakes you like and no one cares about your personal experience from yesteryear on a bolt when there are literally dozens of people who Ted owes product, warranty and money to.

Well, that was the point. andy2 no less accused us of fronting for a shady manufacturer, while we receive some sort of back handers in the forms of product. All the time flaunting the fact we're someone an 'elite' group.


As for andy2 and every other self-entitled WW member, to be clear:

- I have never purchased nor received a single item from Ted. His email yesterday was the second time I've ever conversed with him - all the while he has admitted to his short comings. To suggest there's some sort of cover up here is ignorant at best, insulting and bordering libellous at worst.

- Threads like these, as Juan stated, respect the opinions of the end users and serve as a public service announcement. We have only removed the posts by one other in addition to CL, as we do not see these boards as a place for the issues between a manufacturer and a dealer. There is a whole lot more going on than the WW public need to know - and is a matter for Ted and CL to resolve in private. If anything Ted could have said more, on here, about it. But then I would have removed that too and reiterated the above point.

- The only other post (that was removed) was a new account who posted something that was suspiciously too supportive of Ted. But lets not let the truth get in the way of a good public lynching.

- Posts that are about positive experiences in relation to Ciamillo, especially that by Lewolive, are left to show other users that not all parts of the company suffer the same customer service issues as Ciamillo USA. That it is, in fact, a stand alone company. How that could possibly be seen as the same as what is occurring with CL is...baffling.

Finally (and this is primarily for Adam), you have a choice. If none of this is to your satisfaction then please keep in mind that WW is a voluntary membership, you're welcome to revoke it any time you please. However (speaking strictly for myself) I have never received anything (short of abuse) for being a mod on here, so to be accused of covering for a company that I have absolutely no reason to protect is beyond ludicrous.

My PM box is open for apologies Adam (and the rest). But somehow doubt I'll see anything more than vitriol.


/thread