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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 1:56 am 
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Is the newer clincher version of the Conti GP4000 really an improvement over the older? I heard the sidewalls may be thinner. I need a good race tire that has more puncture protection than the Vittoria Open Corsa which I have had a run of bad luck with. Also is it really true that t 25s are actually faster than 23s?

Thanks for help and suggestions (yes I know I should go tubular but can't afford new wheels right now so looking for best clincher).


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:27 am 
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Location: Taylosville, Utah
I'm a big fan of the 4000S's and as far as I can tell, the only difference between them is that the new II's are available in colors, and a 700x28 width.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 3:35 am 
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25s have worse aero and no advantage for rolling resistance. In fact my 25mm GP4000s have markedly worse RR than 23s I've tested (presumably because they made an update and the 25s are from before that). I haven't tested any MkII 25mms - hopefully the construction is standardised so there is no RR penalty.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 3:54 am 
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I just rode a new set of version 25mm 4000s II's down in Arizona for a week. Don't know what the difference is between the plain 4000s. I used to run 4000s in 23mm. I do not believe the 25's are "faster" than 23's. Guess they're more comfortable by virtue of more air volume however. And I hear what you're saying about the Vittoria Open Corsa CX's. My experience with the Vittorias was that they cut just from looking at them sideways.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 4:26 am 
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new colors, new glossy packaging,new wider options - LBS selling USD 2 more.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 4:48 am 
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Out of curiosity, are your Vittoria's, Open Corsa I, II, or III? I noticed a big difference in durability (new ones are better) from the original.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 6:03 am 
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Location: Albuquerque, NM
With everyone blowing the GP4000 tires out at ~$38, the new version would have to be pretty amazing to justify a 100% increase in price.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 6:20 am 
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^ can't really compare in that manner... I use the 25's v2... but used v1 in 23.. so no direct comparison. I like the 25's very much.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 3:55 pm 
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Location: Ruidoso, NM
cyclenutnz wrote:
25s have worse aero and no advantage for rolling resistance. In fact my 25mm GP4000s have markedly worse RR than 23s I've tested (presumably because they made an update and the 25s are from before that). I haven't tested any MkII 25mms - hopefully the construction is standardised so there is no RR penalty.


That's interesting. Should have lower Crr... same casing, tread and everything, just bigger.

What was "updated"?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 6:43 pm 
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Location: Santa Cruz, California, USA
spookyload wrote:
With everyone blowing the GP4000 tires out at ~$38, the new version would have to be pretty amazing to justify a 100% increase in price.


Note the gp4000 and gp4000s are different tires.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 11:31 pm 
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http://www.slowtwitch.com/Products/Thin ... _3946.html


conti's own data proves wider is lower rr.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 1:41 am 
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Location: Perth, Western Australia
I'm with WMW and spartan.
Tour magazine has also tested wider tyres and results show lower rolling resistance.
The pro peleton is moving to 25mm tyres due to lower rolling resistance, another effect is a slightly wider contact patch which provides more grip and they are generally able to run slightly lower pressures which improves comfort.
Sounds like a win/win/win to me.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:18 am 
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You forgot heavier... win/win/win/lose

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:28 am 
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Location: Ruidoso, NM
Ozrider wrote:
The pro peleton is moving to 25mm tyres due to lower rolling resistance


The pros all ride tubulars on wide rims. a 25mm tubular is no wider than a 23mm clincher on a wide rim.

Another loser besides weight is aero.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 9:26 pm 
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I'm curious... There's a lot of stuff out there (mostly marketing) that suggests wider is better, faster, blah blah blah. And people never seem to question it. I'm not sure I believe it all. If a 25 is faster than a 23, I can't seem to tell in the real world, and I've been trying. I have multiple sets of different wheels with different sized tires of the same brand. If I had to say which of my boras were faster between the ones with the 23mm Veloflex Carbons or the set with the 25mm Veloflex Arenbergs at this point I'd say the 23's are faster. The 25's are definitely more comfortable and more stable but for all out speed I gotta say I "think" the 23's would win out.
And even if it's all in my head above, I think it's safe to say that at some point a wider tire will in fact be slower without question simply due to the added friction between tire and road. You wouldn't want to run a motorcycle tire (if it would fit) for instance. As for what pros ride let's be real about the fact that pros ride, for the most part, what their sponsors tell them to ride. And for tubulars at least, I don't think a wider rim bed does squat. Different story for clinchers, admittedly, and from a money making size of martlet perspective, clinchers are where it's at. So it shouldn't be a big surprise that manufacturers want their riders on wider rims if it makes them sell, even though they're still running tubulars. I'll keep testing them out but at the end of the day if I can't experience a real benefit in something then as far as I'm concerned it's all hype.


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