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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 1:45 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2013 1:25 pm
Posts: 27
yubbers wrote:
I'm gonna give these a go. I already look ridiculous in spandex so might as well go all out.
http://jet.reconinstruments.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


How would those work exactly? I know they would connect with the Garmin Vector pedals to put the power information on the HUD. But what about GPS riding f.e.? Would the glasses connect with a GPS app on your smartphone to project the route information on the HUD?

Looks interesting.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:18 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:03 am
Posts: 620
Location: nyc
Perhaps I was too harsh in my posting I realize nobody likes to find out their expensive equipment doesn't work as promised, I apologize. But I found it shocking how inaccurate the unit was at performing the functions it was advertised exactly to do and under pretty easy conditions. The mtg course was nearby upstate NY and adjacent to an active airport and military base so I am positive satellite and GPS reception is very very strong there and there is only moderate tree cover. I guess I am partially annoyed since the 510 seemed like it would solve so many "wants" in a computer and fell short enough that I could not rationalize the purchase. And reviews I've read of Strava seem to point out similar inconsistencies and inaccuracies in data when checked with multiple devices, GPS/satellite/cell reception for same course waypoints (all registered different speeds and locations) on same ride and between multiple riders at same time/ride. So it just seems the industry is vastly over-inflating accuracy and consistency of data to me. These just have not performed to the level they are advertised - even the best of them, not to mention the smaller, less powerful units such as Cateye and Sunto, Sigma etc.

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Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:18 pm 
  • Garmin Edge 810
  • 579.00 €   from 349.90 € (including 19% VAT)
  • in stock


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:55 pm 
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Posts: 2294
Location: On the bike
My 510 is the complete opposite of what gitsome is talking about. My 510 is accurate enough that I can see what side of the road I was riding on when I look at my route and also if there was a lane closed/pothole and I had to merge left. Thing is bomb proof and has been very very accurate. My 510 works as promised. The 510 does NOT fall short of any of my wants. Has been better than using my iPhone when recording the same route, which makes sense as the 510 uses the GPS + GLONASS vs. the iPhone GPS.

No issue of Garmin over inflating the accuracy for the 510 in my experience. Has been consistent since new.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 9:20 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 16, 2010 7:28 pm
Posts: 613
The point about Strava is that if the device is inaccurate, it puts a blip in the middle of your route and your segment data is garbage. So yeah, most of the time it does indeed do what it's supposed to.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 5:52 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2012 3:55 pm
Posts: 7
kulivontot wrote:
Garmin GPS doesn't work well in wooded mountain bike trails in new york? You don't say. Clearly the device must be garbage.
Run your iphone GPS on the same course and see the results it gives you. GPS isn't magic, there's a radio signal traveling from 12000 miles away. Obviously obstructions will mess with the reception strength. That's why your radio goes out under a bridge, except your radio station is located 2-3 orders of magnitude closer than a GPS satellite.
Now a dedicated GPS device like a garmin is going to do WAY better than the one embedded in your smartphone, because it doesn't have the additional noise of all the other components running in the background. A device with GLONASS will do even better than that. Your secondhand one-time anecdotal experience seems at odds with the THOUSANDS of strava users who seem to do just fine tracking their progress.


With all due respect, your post is terribly misleading...

Before I got a Garmin 500, I used an iPhone 4 (using Motion-X GPS app) and later an iPhone 5 (running Strava app). When I uploaded my rides to Strava using the Garmin 500, many times one or more segments would be missing due to GPS drift. Segments which were curiously NOT missed with the iPhone 5. It's gotten to the point where I run the Strava app concurrently on the iPhone as a backup in case the Garmin 500 misses any segments, which is quite frankly ridiculous considering it's (an expensive) dedicated GPS device which should theoretically be better...

Here's a great example, a ride from San Francisco to Muir Woods, and then up a smooth fire road and then paved road to the summit of Mt Tamalpias and back. There are a couple short of segments that the Garmin missed, yet were recorded with the iPhone 5 tucked into a rear jersey pocket. One of these segments was in fact a KOM (Walsh Crusher). If you compare the two tracks, you can see that the iPhone generally follows the road more closely, especially under tree cover.

Ride recorded with Garmin 500

Same ride recorded with Strava app running on iPhone 5 in jersey pocket

So if it wasn't for the iPhone backup I would have robbed of a well-earned KOM! :evil:

This is kind of a big deal - after all, I've been told that the name Strava is actually a acronym for:

System
That
Records
All
Vain
Activity
:thumbup:

I couldn't figure out how the iPhone could consistantly track better than the Garmin (especially since it's mounted out in the clear on the front of the bike), but very recently I stumbled on an blog post that mentioned that the iPhone used a GPS/GLONASS chip. I poked around some more and found that Apple has indeed been using GPS/GLONASS chips in the iPhone since the iPhone 4s (released Oct. 2011). GLONASS capability is also why the Garmin 510 generally tracks much better and loses less signal than the Garmin 500; it's potentially seeing double the number of satellites. It's easy to compare rides on Strava as you can see which devices are used. There's no question that the Garmin 510 blows the 500 out of the water, plain and simple. Hell, my iPhone 5 consistantly blows the Garmin 500 out of the water! Most likely the Garmin 500 is using the same (outdated) electronics since it's introduction a few years ago, whereas smart phones are constantly evolving with newer and better chips. Needless to say, I'll be getting rid of the 500 and getting a 510.

Here's a Dec 2011 post from the chipset manufacturer Qualcomm touting the benefits of the GLONASS capable chips:

GPS and GLONASS: “Dual-core" Location For Your Phone

It's borderline criminal that Garmin still hasn't updated the 500, they'd much rather sell you the more expensive 510. Some of us would actually prefer a smaller, lighter unit incorporating the latest chipset technology (go figure)...


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 7:22 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:30 am
Posts: 277
Yeah the Garmin 500 is rubbish. Not sure why some advocate saving some money and going 500 instead of 510. You might as well light your money and fire and use your smartphone. The GPS chip and resulting signal is frustrating at best and almost useless when in the mountains or other environmental objects that will block the signal. I think the 510 represents the best option available in my opinion.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 9:24 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 16, 2010 7:28 pm
Posts: 613
For comparison, I have a much outdated garmin 305 and an iphone4. All my friends have iphone4's or less. My gps data is consistently less noisy. Maybe with glonass phone GPS has caught up? But I still believe glonass garmin > phone glonass. However, these kinds of discussions I can appreciate, because they provide a reasonable comparison between devices. Show me a plot of SNR over time across a ride using more than one device and I'll be satisfied.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 7:09 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:12 pm
Posts: 137
gitsome wrote:
Garmin GPS sucks

I must say I was in the market for a GPS computer recently, checked out Garmin 800 series (too big) and 500 series. When I looked at the 510 gps readings from a friends mountainbike route I was AMAZED at the INACCURACY of it!!! He did 4 loops of the exact same trail (single-track no less) for a race. When we looked at the plotted lines of the "mapping" function --- Hoolly COW! They were ALL OFF by no LESS than 50-200 feet per line!!!! It was 4 distinct lines that varied completely fro each other despite the trail being less than a foot wide!!! What a piece of shittte!

I would never buy a GPS computer now given what I saw. Save the money, buy a nice Assos jacket or a new set pedals or a few bottle of great wine. SCREW Garmin


I couldn't agree more. I think garmin cyclin products suck. I sold mine it was suck an outdated piece of crap. Overpriced too.

I had two for my sailboat and they are great. A small handheld and a bigger touchscreen and for what you get from garmin for $700 for your boat it makes this 810 look like it should cost about $100. I mean have you seen what they can do with GPS these days? I can't figure out why the bike garmin is so pixelated and bad. The boat ones are beautiful.

Get an assos jacket and knickers and use your iphone


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:35 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:03 am
Posts: 620
Location: nyc
These units are inaccurate even when they have a full signal (and thus will not blip like strava when it losses signal) and so you cannot really trust the data you get even when they seem to be working properly. They will look like they had full signal (and they did) and put forth data but it is not accurate and the margin by which I found it to be off (and others have observed) do not make me confident it is worth the $200-500 they cost, wish they did.

I thinnk GPS and cell are great technologies when you can afford to be off by 200 ft for general purposes but for cycling they are not precise enough. I wonder if its a national security offset. Civilian GPS used to have a programmed bug where it would "blip"and be purposely off-set so that foreign (navies mostly) forces could not intercept it and utilize it when the US was the leading power in this respect. Sometime Around late 90s the GPS "wobble" was removed but I wonder if this fuzzy accuracy was instituted in its place for the same reason. Sat this time Russian GPS (Glasnat or whatever I guess) came online, but I don;t think Russian space technology has been worth a bottle of vodka since 1957.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:29 am 
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Location: On the bike
You realize that the Garmin will also use the old school wheel magnet if gps signal is crappy? Just seems the Garmin hatorade is in full source. The Garmin can do things even my iphone 5 can't. Garmin 510 for the win.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:16 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2012 4:27 pm
Posts: 300
My garmin 800 works fine for me. it drops signals, sometimes, sure, but only when I'm in tunnels. works fine for me in the city.

you're not guiding a multi-million dollar missile into a death star exhust port with your GPS, you dont need hyper accurate readings. if my garmin gives me good enough figures for my training I'm happy. understand the limitations of the technology and work with it.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:59 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:58 pm
Posts: 179
Location: Wet coast, Canada
davidalone wrote:
My garmin 800 works fine for me. it drops signals, sometimes, sure, but only when I'm in tunnels. works fine for me in the city.

you're not guiding a multi-million dollar missile into a death star exhust port with your GPS, you dont need hyper accurate readings. if my garmin gives me good enough figures for my training I'm happy. understand the limitations of the technology and work with it.


This is the best summary I have read about GPS! LMAO.

FWIW, I have a newish 510 and I can confirm that tracking with GPS/Glonass duality is much improved compared to my 500. For those just getting into the GPS cycling computer game I would definitely recommend the 510 over the 500.

And for those Strava-obsessed types out there, if you think your bad GPS tracking caused you to miss a segment that is near and dear to you, there are tools to fix rides:

http://strava-tools.raceshape.com/snap/


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:03 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:45 am
Posts: 64
If you are looking for options check out the new Magellan Cyclo 500 - http://www.bicycles.net.au/2013/09/mage ... m7QXpSzskE

Not sure on the technical specifications but from the media releases it should easily be a strong competitor to Garmin. For what its worth I have a 910XT (Multi Sport watch) which has been great as a training tool, not so much as a GPS tracker. Frequent dropped signals etc, which is ok for what I want it for but not something I was expecting from it when I initially purchased it.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 2:53 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2013 1:25 pm
Posts: 27
All the positive reactions here on the Garmin devices led me to decide to go for the Garmin Edge 810.
I found this 810 on ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Garmin-Edge-810 ... 23312c28af

It's about $45 less expensive than the cheapest price on Amazon. Would you guys go for this? Cannot find anything on the internet on the seller (except for the reviews in ebay). The warranty is the same whatever seller you buy it from, right?


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 3:06 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:03 am
Posts: 620
Location: nyc
Glonass:

http://spectrum.ieee.org/aerospace/sate ... ling-short

Like i said, its your money not mine, but even the Russians don't like it, lol!

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Posted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 3:06 pm 
  • Garmin Edge 810
  • 579.00 €   from 349.90 € (including 19% VAT)
  • in stock


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