HOT: Active* forum members generally gain 5% discount at starbike.com store!
Weight Weenies
* FAQ    * Search    * Trending Topics
* Login   * Register
HOME Listings Articles FAQ Contact About




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 40 posts ] 
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 10:45 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:41 am
Posts: 18
Mccaria wrote:
I have a Dogma 2 and a R5 VWD. The Dogma is a 57.5 cm and the R5 is the 58 cm. The geometry is very different, especially noticeable at the head tube where on the D2 I have spacers under the stem, whereas with the R5 I struggle to get low enough and have been experimenting with a -17' stem.

The R5 is a very light bike, quite discreet paintwork and very simple external cabling. Some of the internal finish on the carbon is rougher and of course it has the BBright bottom bracket (which I am not a fan of, but others like). The D2 is a more solid (heavier) frameset with opulent "look at me" paintwork, I find it a better finished frame and I like threaded BBs (albeit this is Italian)

As em3 says, these are very different frames. If I wanted a bike for a lot of climbing, then I would go for the R5 frame (as long as you can get the bars in the right position with the long head tube), for a more aggressive ride on flatter roads then it would be the D2.


Thanks. My S5 has -17 stem solution so I think it would go with R5 for more or less the same. The reason I'm interested the D2 also is that even that my goals are more climbing oriented (my category A-races includes lot of climbing) the country that I'm living is more or less flat (Finland) with only minor hills (so no mountains). So the races are also more flat oriented. So the D2 would be best of both world kind of solution for me. Or at least the pros are winning mountain stages with the Dogma. And I'm not referencing myself as one, only using as a example...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 10:57 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:32 am
Posts: 19
Hey RoyalV,

Been a while since I have been to Finland, don't remember it being overly hill, just remember it being brutally cold and dark!

I see what you mean if it is a straight comparison D2 to R5, but I am not sure that the D2 necessarily gives you best of both worlds. Wouldn't something like a Canyon SLX or Cannondale S6 Evo, give you a good racing position without the additional weight of the D2 ?


Top
 Profile  
 
Posted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 10:57 am 


Top
  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 11:30 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:41 am
Posts: 18
I've been thinking about both. For some reason Cannondale is not giving me the wibe (even though I'm sure it's a great bike). Canyon would be nice picks also. My only consider about it is the why lot of people are using the Aeroad instead? And I'm talking about the race drivers. Only because the weight?

I'm also a small rider, so I don't think the D2 or D65.1 would be too heavy in size 50? Buildable for 6.8kgs with normal parts (not everything expensive and fragile)?

Ps. Still don't state myself as a race driver, or that it would be because of the bikes, but nice results for Dogmas ja R5's todays Tour of Beijing climbing stage (top4 all either or).

Pps. Yes, and it's cold and dark at winter. Loads of trainer time ahead...


Last edited by RoyalV on Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:35 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 10:47 am
Posts: 894
Location: somewere floating between here and the other side
I just read the newly released and last isseu of tour quaterly, the german road mag that availible via itunes, in none of the two issieu do the mention the pinarello's you speak of but the last issue has an aero road bike test and the current one had a 2500 euro bike shootout, i would deffintly consider looking a bitt more at canyon, unless you dont like the look of them ?the canyon i belive won the 2500 dollar shotout, comes with full chorus and kysriums and under 7 killos out of the box in 57 cm setup


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:30 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:12 pm
Posts: 6
I just bought the Focus Izalco SL Team 2.0 that was reviewed against the Dogma you mention and the Cervelo California and rated higher. I love this focus. Im a heavier rider and I like to stand and climb and I ride more of a sprinter style. I cannot say enough good things about how this bike climbs. It also provides a nice compliant ride on the cobbled roads in the rural areas where I ride. This is a light bike out of the box as well. Focus has a few left and they are blowing them out in the states right now.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 6:07 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:41 am
Posts: 18
I believe all the tests (especially the "best bike" ones) are somewhat marketing. Example: "If you buy full page ad from our next issue, you get your bike reviewed in our mag" (just for example). So some bikes might be left out just because they don't want to buy. But I don't say it will be the case mentioned.

As far as Dogma - I haven't heard any bad word about it. Only that it might be heavier than the "weather weight" frames and it's expensive. That's why want to know more about it. :)

Mccaria: How would you describe the Dogma handling and riding abilities (even for just a few words). How it responses powertransfer wise (acceleration)?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 10:41 am
Posts: 29
Location: NY
You should really look at Parlee. At the price points of those two bikes you're right within the ballpark. You can even get it done custom, both for size, handling, AND ride quality.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:50 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:32 am
Posts: 19
Apologies RoyalV, got distracted by work.

Not sure what you want to hear ! The D2 is a quality frame, it can be built up reasonably light, but will never be the lightest bike. It handles well -I have a lot of confidence that it will go where I point it and is more than stiff enough through the BB for my riding. Acceleration is not quite as quick as some of the lighter frames I've ridden, but difference for me is marginal (maybe more of an issue for you if you are racing ?). Criticism tends to be based more on its looks, the weight and the cost rather than how it performs. If you are ok with those aspects (and you seem to be !) then it will build up into a really good bike.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 11:52 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 10:47 am
Posts: 894
Location: somewere floating between here and the other side
[quote="RoyalV"]I believe all the tests (especially the "best bike" ones) are somewhat marketing. Example: "If you buy full page ad from our next issue, you get your bike reviewed in our mag" (just for example). So some bikes might be left out just because they don't want to buy. But I don't say it will be the case mentioned.

This paticulair magazine would be the exeption to that rule, i dont bother reading anything else but most of us here would agree i think that these germans are ver ' grundlich '(;


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:56 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:41 am
Posts: 18
Mccaria wrote:
Apologies RoyalV, got distracted by work.

Not sure what you want to hear ! The D2 is a quality frame, it can be built up reasonably light, but will never be the lightest bike. It handles well -I have a lot of confidence that it will go where I point it and is more than stiff enough through the BB for my riding. Acceleration is not quite as quick as some of the lighter frames I've ridden, but difference for me is marginal (maybe more of an issue for you if you are racing ?). Criticism tends to be based more on its looks, the weight and the cost rather than how it performs. If you are ok with those aspects (and you seem to be !) then it will build up into a really good bike.


Thanks for the opinion. I'm pretty sure that the R5 is my pick (all the aspects considered). Dogma & Canyon CF SLX comes to close, but...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 7:52 am 
Offline
Shop Wrench
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:30 am
Posts: 79
Location: Gloucester, UK
RoyalV

Have had a go on both, although am not a particularly good climber :(

I thought both went uphill as well as each other, but the Dogma 65.1 was better at descending the other side :D
So for me, on a ride which is Col after Col after Col, the Dogma 65.1 would be the one for me

Send us a mail if you want to chat in length further :)

regards
IanSWBB

_________________
www.southwestbikebuilders.co.uk

https://www.facebook.com/pages/South-We ... 4745587802


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 9:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:41 am
Posts: 18
Thanks IanSWBB - I'll send you message later today (when I get rid of work). :)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 9:17 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:32 am
Posts: 19
ianSWBB,

That's an interesting perspective - for me the R5 climbs better than the D2 (haven't tried a 65.1) and the Dogma descends better. My logic for long climbing days is that the time ratio is approximately 4 : 1 (climbing : descending) so on a ride with lots of climbs I would always go for the R5 since I am spending so much more time climbing.

RoyalV

I think for your type of use the R5 is a good call. If I was looking for a bike for racing I don't think it would be a Dogma (probably go Cannondale S6 Evo)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 2:30 pm 
Offline
Shop Wrench
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:30 am
Posts: 79
Location: Gloucester, UK
RoyalV - OK

Mccaria - as I said, my problem is that I am not a good enough climber to significantly notice the difference between the 2. But for me it boils down to that never-ending conundrum - e.g when riding La Marmotte - do you want the bike that completes the course in the fastest time (probably the Dogma 65.1) or do you want the bike that sets the fastest climb segment times (probably the R5)

_________________
www.southwestbikebuilders.co.uk

https://www.facebook.com/pages/South-We ... 4745587802


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:41 am
Posts: 18
I thought it would be better to continue discussion 'in public', so I would like to hear more about your views about these bikes. At the moment I'm still leaning for r5 (mainly of it's climbing nature), but still intrigued of Dogma (overall nature & reviews and the results that are made with it in pro peloton (and in mountains))... epic battle...


Top
 Profile  
 
Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:33 pm 


Top
  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 40 posts ] 
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: amey, Bing [Bot], dane476, Exabot [Bot], Google [Bot], kya, Permon, PhilWalterNZ, physeter, rrzhodino, toride, WeightySteve and 85 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

   Similar Topics   Author   Replies   Views   Last post 
There are no new unread posts for this topic. Pinarello Dogma2 vs Canyon Aeroad cf 9.0

[ Go to page: 1, 2, 3 ]

in Road

Pepsi

31

4018

Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:41 am

dominikk View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. The all new Pinarello Dogma F8...

[ Go to page: 1 ... 5, 6, 7 ]

in Road

ichobi

96

11086

Thu Jul 10, 2014 11:25 pm

ultimobici View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. pinarello dogma 60.1 rear brake

in Road

Post Man Pat

4

916

Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:54 pm

scamper View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Dogma 60.1 (2009) vs. Dogma 65.1 geometry

in Road

Permon

1

596

Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:22 am

haydos View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. SiSL2 for Dogma F8

in Road

gregalfa

1

491

Tue Jul 08, 2014 4:24 am

hornedfrog View the latest post


It is currently Mon Sep 01, 2014 9:07 pm

All times are UTC + 1 hour




Advertising   –  FAQ   –  Contact   –  Convert   –  About

© Weight Weenies 2000-2013
hosted by starbike.com


How to get rid of these ads? Just register!


Powered by phpBB