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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 7:48 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 23, 2010 9:08 pm
Posts: 377
I guess I have to assess each based on my age and fitness at the time and what I looked for in a bike. My number 1 favourite (Merckx MXL) was the bike that I raced when I was in my late twenties and at the peak of my fitness. I am sure that if I rode it today in my mid forties I would find it heavy and uncomfortable, but at the time, it was a beautiful riding bike and served its purpose better than anything I have ridden since.

1) Eddy Merckx MX Leader - stiff, robust, beautifully made, rode like no other
2) Colnago C40 - like floating down the road, and perfect geometry
3) Seven Axiom - my first custom bike, and despite owning several titanium bikes since, still the best
4) Cannondale CAAD5 - felt space age at the time (BB30, internal headset, oversized main tubes with slim seatstays), but it felt light, smooth and comfortable despite the aluminium tubes.
5) Moots Vamoots RSL - on paper the best bike I have ever owned, and certainly up there in the top 5, but not the very best because it lacks the fabled titanium ride comfort, but it is craftsmen built, stiff, light, comfortable and probably the bike that I will end up keeping for the longest (or until road discs come out in force)

Not many mentions of the other end of the scale in terms of the worst, but here goes. Suprisingly, some of the same brands appear at both ends of my scale, so brand loyalty is not alway a guarantee of success.

1) Specialized Allez Epic (the original aluminium and carbon glued together) - broke every one I owned (3 in one season!). Noodly, lacked stiffness and broke easily.
2) Pegoretti Responsorium (shock, gasp, blasphemy!!) - lacked the ride quality of steel, and despite a beautiful paint job, never really lived up to the hype
3) Seven Aerios (now the Axiom SLX) - triple butted, super light, but somehow didn't ride very nicely at all. Not smooth like ti, and didn't feel as light as I had hoped.
4) Pinarello Prince (aluminium/carbon version)- Pinarello's hiccup between the steel and carbon eras.
5) Specialized S Works M2 - ugly, harsh, poor geometry

I have still got every Pro Cycling and Cycle Sport magazine ever published. Always fun to look back at different eras of bikes. The late 90's/early 2000's were not a vintage era. Before that, bikes were slim, Italian, steel, sexy looking things built by craftsmen. With the end of Indurain's reign, then came the aluminium era and the early days of carbon (and sometimes a mix of the 2!), when bikes, components and kit really got hit by the ugly stick hard, until things looked up again of late post Armstrong (no reference to him BTW, just trying to reference a point in time), and todays kit will stand the test of time I think.

Just to prove my point, how many posts are there swooning over reinvented steel classics? (lots) How many posts are there swooning over modern kit? (lots) How many posts are there reminissing about late 90's bikes, early aero wheels, 9 speed etc? (none).


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:04 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 4:42 am
Posts: 897
Location: Calgary
I'm still loving this thread as some love what others hate - e.g. several votes for the Cervelo R3 that I rode twice and sold and others disliking the Colnagos I like.

solarider, I'm with you on the Responsorium. After hearing for years who wonderful they are, I bought one last year, rode it less than 500 km, tried to sell it to someone who'd bought two of my Parlees and had an old al Peg that was showing its age. He liked it but his wife decided he had enough bikes so it's been hanging in the garage unridden all year. Maybe I'll give it a good cleaning and put it on eBay. Neat craftsmanship

Re late 90s dead spot. I understand where you're coming from. However, there are lots of votes for the C40. I bought my first in 1995 and the Bstay came out 19around 99 or 2000. Maybe it's the exception that proves the rule.


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Posted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:04 pm 


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 5:27 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 9:47 pm
Posts: 1737
Location: Santa Cruz, California, USA
The early R3s felt harsh through the saddle on larger bumps due to the huge inflexible seatpost. The R3SL and later R3s use a 27.2mm post (and smaller seat tube although I don't think it makes nearly the difference the post does). They don't have the same harshness on big hits. It was very noticeable when I went from my original very early R3 to an R3SL.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 5:42 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:19 pm
Posts: 195
Responsorium owners. Is it stiff? I've had one on my shortlist for awhile but have always feared that it wouldn't be stiff enough. I currently ride a Duell passion that is just about perfect in terms of stiffness to forgiveness. I'd hate to shell out a ton on a Ciavete and find out it's a noodle. I'm not expecting it to be a big leg emma by any stretch. Just stiffer than steel frames of the past.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:08 am 
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Yes, very stiff. Too stiff for me in fact. It is an out-and-out race machine and lacking in the comfort that some steel bikes posess.

Personally after a long time riding titanium, it wasn't to my taste. Probably the Marcelo would have been better for me.

It is a work of art, and very responsive as the name implies, but not your average steel bike.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:34 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:19 pm
Posts: 195
It sounds perfect. Thank you!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:30 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 10:47 am
Posts: 905
Location: somewere floating between here and the other side
Boolinwall.
if you want a nice comfy pegoretti, go with the duende, i had a marcello for years and spend a fair bitt of time on a couple of different models while i lived in caldonazzo. the marcello is very well ballanced and i think it might be his best bike, its ridable for day with out getting beating up, i dont what gave you the idea it might be a noodle but, their solid.keep in mind i ride a 63 cm and since they dont customise tubing per size they certainly feel wobbly in smaller sizes (-: go test drive one !


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:19 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:19 pm
Posts: 195
I've been looking at pegoretti's for ages. The Emma is the ideal bike for my riding style. But finding one or waiting for one are not really options. I worried about the Respo not being stiff due to it being made of XCR. Strong, rustproof, but also quite light. Light and stiff don't usual go together with steel. Plus, it's listed as a comfortable ride. Again, comfy and stiff don't usually match up with steel. I have looked at the Duende and do like the idea of saving $2,000. But I live in a coastal community with salted roads all winter. Stainless steel just simply makes sense. I do appreciate the input.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 6:04 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:32 pm
Posts: 493
Do these Pegorettis have standard tube dimensions?


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:26 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:19 pm
Posts: 195
No, he has Columbus draw oversized tubing for him. Plus, he has them heat treat Comlumbus spirit tubing. To the best of my knowledge, he's the only one doing that. It adds extra springiness to the steel. It's already more than strong enough without it.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:21 am 
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Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:32 pm
Posts: 493
Thanks. I think Scapin had custom Columbus tubes, but I'm not sure about these days


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:02 pm 
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in the industry
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Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2004 6:31 pm
Posts: 337
Colnago C59
S-Works Venge
BMC SLT01
Zipp 2001

Each of these bikes has its own personality.

_________________
carbonLORD.com


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:45 pm 
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Location: somewere floating between here and the other side
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The marcello and the stainless frame are bassed around 38 and 35/32mm round tubbing, late 90's this was an uncommon size but today a pretty common tube size nowerday's
All main tube supliers run these sizes in steel and even bigger, from what i gather from the columbus website all spirit/life is heat treathed, but could be wrong


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:26 pm 
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Thanks. I don't know much at all about Pegorettis


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:22 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:56 pm
Posts: 484
Location: Reno, NV
I rate mine on stiff, sharp race bikes for the top 4 and best all around 5th.

1. Super6 (std not hi-mod)
2. S-works sl3 (rode better than the sl4 to me)
3. S-works Venge
4. Caad 10
5. Ruegamer Zen


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Posted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:22 pm 


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