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 Post subject: Campy 2015 dilemma...
PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:20 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:50 pm
Posts: 60
Location: Tampere | Finland
Two options to choose from :

1. Full Campagnolo Chorus groupset

or

2. Campagnolo Record : Levers, FD, RD, chain , Chorus : brakes and casette, AND Rotor 24mm crankset. Here "record" can be replaced by "chorus" - I don't care about Record "blink" - functionality for the money is main priority.


My BIG issue is possible ( unavoidable ? ) torubles with BB shell and Campagnolo crank : frame is PF30, now has installed Rotor 4624 bb- fits and works perfectly without single sound from it ( Ultegra 6800 crank ) . Have 2nd (CX) bike as well with same BB and Rotor 3D 36-46 crankset - no complaints here : after about 3-4k km bearings still like new, and completely noiseless.

I do love new Campy crank look, but afraid of constant issues with creaking ( I do have OCD about any noises coming from bike ;) ) . From the second hand, maybe ( if ) better front shifting on Campy crank would be worth to take a "risk" ?

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 Post subject: Campy 2015 dilemma...
Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:20 am 


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:47 am 
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Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:23 pm
Posts: 187
Praxis to the rescue if you want you want a Chorus/Record UltraTorque crank and PF30 with no creaking. Don't use Campy press in cups. Understanding this poor design, Praxis has seized the opportunity and developed an expanding collet BB that works for both BB30 and PF30 expressly designed for Campy cranks. Product of the year if you are a Campy guy. Will be even more robust than the Rotor 4624BB in fact. You keep the same bearings pressed on the half shafts of a Campy crank. BB environment mimics Campy press in or threaded cups only having the cups attached to each other throughout the BB which mitigates creaking.

You use the press in PF30 bushings that came with your PF30 which are held tightly in place with the Praxis BB.

I will go on to say IMO a Campy UltraTorque crank with either external threaded cups or new Praxis BB is about the best crank/BB combination on the market and I have worked on most of them. By contract a Campy UT crank with press in cups is about the worst and hence your concern....PF30 being more problematic than BB30 for Campy press in cups due to the lubricity of Delrin.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 2:32 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:58 am
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Search. Plenty of recommendations.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 2:47 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2006 2:36 am
Posts: 1184
Location: UK
stormur, have you considered a Campag Over-Torque chainset specifically designed for BB30 / PF30?


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 2:52 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:50 pm
Posts: 60
Location: Tampere | Finland
I did.. but OT seems to be pricey comparing to crank purchased "as groupset" , and to Rotor ( already have chainrings & bb, so bassically need crank only ) .

Plus "allure" of new 4arm campagnolo crank ;)

I don't need recommendations ;) I need experience :)

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 4:12 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:23 pm
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It would be OK if OT were just pricey. OT is a PITA because it is a pressed spline and requires special tooling. UT is a much better design. Further, UT + Praxis BB averts ills associated with BB/PF30.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:00 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 7:39 am
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Campy redesigned the OSfit cups (BB30, PF30, BB86) for 2015. They should work much better than the old ones.
It Should not be a problem if you use loctite. Sometime my mechanic uses a bit of epoxy and never had a problem.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:20 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:50 pm
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Location: Tampere | Finland
I don't think that I'll be even close to be eager to use epoxy to install cups in CF frame …( I won't be even far from it … that will be next galaxy ;) )

In 1 frame I used retainer ( works fine ) in other just grease - same result :)

Anyway , thanks for info about redisigned BB cups ! I missed this info on campy site .


Frame for new groupset is made with very high accuracy, so I'm close to give a chance Campa crank… I just need to see pricing ( on some stores are prices for "pre-order", but I'd like to wait for prices for "on stock" items) .

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:58 pm 
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Point to be made here is in spite of Campy's much needed redesign of their OSfit cups for 2015, separate press fit cups will never match the security of either English threaded Campy external bearing cups or the new Campy UltraTorque Praxis BB designed for BB/PF30. This is for the simple reason that as with Campy's threaded cups what UT was originally designed for, the Praxis BB connects both cup bearing bores through the BB shell which makes it much more robust. The Praxis BB is resilient against lateral crank forces unlike separate press fit cups.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 1:00 pm 
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Well it is not uncommon to use low strenght epoxy for some press fit frame. I don't see the problem. The cups can easily be removed without damage.
Obviously you start with loctite and if that doesn't work you follow with epoxy.
From what i've been told, the worst thing for press fit is grease.
The most reliable would be to use the praxis BB.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 1:40 pm 
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I agree with you ferrarista that concern about Loctite and Epoxy is overblown and not using either is many times the underlying reason for integrated BB creak. As to reliability, the Praxis BB is more than just reliable, it is less invasive. No need for adhesive and it mechanically attaches so it is more simple to install and remove as well. It really is the best BB design I have seen in this day of integrated BB's and breathes a lot of new life into Campy UT cranks for the vast array of BB/PF30 bikes out there.


Last edited by highdraw on Tue Oct 07, 2014 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 3:18 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2009 12:24 am
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Use a Parlee Ultra torque adapter on my PF30 frame, no creaking, no problems.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 11:03 pm 
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highdraw wrote:
I agree with you ferrarista that concern about Loctite and Epoxy is overblown and not using either is many times the underlying reason for integrated BB creak. As to reliability, the Praxis BB is more than just reliable, it is less invasive. No need for adhesive and it mechanically attaches so it is more simple to install and remove as well. It really is the best BB design I have seen in this day of integrated BB's and breathes a lot of new life into Campy UT cranks for the vast array of BB/PF30 bikes out there.


Totally agree with you. If I had to choose one it would be the praxis BB because it is a no brainer solution. It is the best for press fit.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 11:29 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:50 pm
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Location: Tampere | Finland
Not so much experience wit Campy :PressFit , but in Rotor 46:24 : on BH I used Loctite ( medium strength retainer with activator ) - noiseless 6th month. On BMC GF01 wasn't so nice ( Bb86:24 ): shell accuracy is way below advertised "BMC high tec" - on same retainer & activator bb was creaking since 1st pedal stroke ( reason why BMC says "only Shimano bb" .... I removed bb, lightly polished surface , clean and plenty of retainer was filling gaps… clearly visible. Then i greased shell wit calcium based marine heavy grease and installed new bb ( again alu cups ) - problem solved .

I think I'll give chance to Campa cups, in case of problems just order Praxis bb cups. Shell is very well made ( accuracy ) , so there's a chance for success :) just have to remove Rotor bb and look for possible "distractors" for Praxis cups.

My frame has 5y warranty, so I have to follow manufacturers instruction : retainer / grease … Using epoxy will void warranty - reason of being "radical" ;)


Still fighting with thoughts : 2011 Record / 2015 Chorus / 2015 Record/Chorus…. I established my budget for it on max 1100€ ( spent waaay to much for bikes this year :) )

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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 11:29 pm 


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2014 5:10 pm 
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Posts: 24
The new OS-fit cup design with the Loctite primer/609 combo that Campagnolo recommends would be super solid if you didn't want to use a two part epoxy. Most frame manufacturers I've come across have a similar recommendation for press fit systems. Also, I'm guessing it will only be a matter of time before the new crank design is available in OT. If you don't plan on removing your cranks often or changing chainrings then the OT is a better option. It is a pressfit spline but it isn't difficult to get off with the Campagnolo tool as long as you grease the splines and check it once in a while. It is also the lightest Campagnolo crank currently in production (including the new design) and gives you the benefit of the stiffer 30mm spindle your bike was meant to utilize.


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