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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 12:20 am 
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Hi,
I am looking to buy some new pedals as my Keos have worn bearings.
Which Keos should I buy? New Blades or Max 2s? Which releasing system should I buy if the Blades? 12NM or 16NM?
Cheers


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 8:13 am 
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I wrote a (P)review for the Keo Blade's viewtopic.php?f=3&t=69921&hilit=keo+blade

I can't compare them to the latest Keo Max 2 but I do own the 'normal' Keo's. Since I took my bike with the 'blades' for a spin this weekend there is a initial shootout between the two. First the Blades come standard with the Yeloow 12N blades.

I will do a bigger update concerning the review on this one later but I'm very pleased. It all feels very gentle and smooth. There is no 'hard' clicking sound while entering the pedals despite this even the yellow 12N blade gives a nice and solid lock on the pedals. It can be compared with a 'normal' Look pedals with the tension around half way the adjustment range. For those who like a very tight fit I might recommend the red 16N blades.

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Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 8:13 am 


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:27 am 
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Are the cleats and hardware the same for both Blade and Max 2?


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:35 am 
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As written in the topic listed above, all the hardware is the same. Andy the pedal itself is different compared to the other gen. Keo's.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 3:46 pm 
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I would say the more cost of the blade is not worth by the keo 2 max!

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:09 pm 
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Does the blade pedal sit right when not in use? My Keo Max 2s don't hang right at all.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 9:34 am 
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Second that, Rich. The Keo 2 Max are a royal pain! I need to get mine looked at.

jipperd - how are the bearings on the Blades? Do they allow the pedals to hang correctly for easy engagement?

I'm sorely tempted.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:05 am 
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Location: France
One thing that worries me about the blades is where the carbon spring is located. Having it positioned at the outer edge leaves it rather exposed to crash damage. Any time I have taken a tumble the outer edge of the pedal is one of the points on the bike ( along with bars and saddle ) that are most likely to get scuffed.

I have just ordered some Keo2Max Carbons to replace my Keo Carbons, will be interesting to see what they are like.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:50 am 
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As written above I only used it for two rides this weekend but I'll try answering your questions.

From the moment I first used them the bearings were just as smooth or even smoother compared with my older Keo Carbon's. Somehow the give me a more solid feel compared to my other Keo Carbon (notice these are not the Keo Max, but the previous gen's.)

The turn into the engagement position right away, so that is a big plus for me. As for the fragile position concerning the carbon blades, I can only confirm it. I do not compete in any kind of races so (hopefully) I won't be having a issue with that much, but it is a weakspot, that's for sure. Second to that I don't know 'How' fragile these blades are, I guess time will tell.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:55 am 
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OK. So I am clear here. Has anyone bought a pair of Blades and used them?
There are enough reviews about what they can/will do and more than enough info to answer ALL the questions except useability.
Repaceable bearings? We think so.
Expensive? Not really. http://www.probikekit.com
Will they hit the ground and shatter the blade? Surely not! Are Look that stupid?
Please Only respond if you can directly compare them.
Cheers


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:40 pm 
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Regarding the Keo 2s not "hanging right", the rubber seals were changed and are bigger compared to the previous Keos, Look has acknowledged that it is a royal pain in the arse and the newer released Keo 2s now have older style seals.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 10:47 pm 
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I have about 500 miles on my Blades, and so far I'm very satisfied with them. I think the engagement is more "secure" than my Keo Carbons, and the 12N version is plenty enough for me. It's actually a much tighter clasp than my Carbons, although they could just be a little on the worn-out side. The nice thing about the blades is the wide surface. I definitely feel I have a more solid feeling underfoot. Not sure what the going rate is for the Keo2, but I got my blades for under $300. Don't think that's too bad.

FWIW, if I worried about what parts on my bike are going to survive a crash, I'd never leave the house! The whole thing is carbon.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:57 am 
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So it sounds like the 12Nm blades are secure enough then? Uncertainty here over the 12Nm Vs 16Nm (and the pedal hang issue I've had with my Max 2s) is what stopped me buying recently.

The wider platform of the Keo Max 2 is what has made me decide to stick with them regardless of the annoying pedal hang - does anyone know if this can be retrospectively corrected by returning them, or easily and cheaply changed with aftermarket parts?

Seriously tempted to pull the trigger on some Blades now...


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:13 am 
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Response from Look, from another thread.
chas@look wrote:
Hi Everyone,

Sorry I didn't notice this thread the first time around...

The issue you're noticing is due to the rubber seal that protects the bearings. If you were to pull the axle assembly out of the pedal, you would find that the bearings actually spin quite smoothly. We used a more robust seal on the new 2MAX, and it causes a little more friction when the pedals are new. We've swapped to a new seal for subsequent runs of the pedal, and should have some of these available at some point once the production rate slows enough to have extras.

I rode mine like that for a few weeks and then removed the seals. I don't really recommend this for wet-weather riding though. Look USA will stock Keo 2 MAX axle/bearing assemblies with the new seals as soon as they're available. These can be ordered through your local LOOK dealer. For those of you outside of the US, I recommend contacting your local dealer or distributor.

Best Regards,
chas

(866)430-5665 - Look USA Customer Service
info@lookcycle-usa.com


A DIY solution:
Cleaner wrote:
I have put over 1k miles on a set of Keo 2 max pedals and they still do not always "fall" into vertical orientation. So they are definitely aware of the issue and may make a running change to production but no retrofitting of units in the field with alternate seals. I appreciate their response and will make the suggested tweak myself when I get some time. I will post my experience post service.

I queried LOOK USA and got this response.

"The design of the Keo2Max pedals have a new outer seal/gasket design to help keep the elements away the bearings and some early run were a tad tight...but we have an easy fix.

It needs a bit of a break-in period for sure, and we are aware of it. The first few manufacturing runs of the pedal the seal tended to be a bit tigher (sic) and took longer to wear in...that's all.

5 minute Easy Fix - Have your shop pull the axle (19mm box-wrench) and just put a bit of Slick Honey on that rubber seal/gasket and it does the job. The seal sits right under the threaded axle collar. The shop will need to Torque wrench it back together at 5.5nm of torque, and that will smooth the seal stiction and relieve the friction of that new seal. Voila... no more hanging pedal.

The seal is really helping with keeping the bearings clean and last longer, so just give a bit more mileage to wear with the Slick Honey on the seal and all should be good.

Thanks for supporting and riding LOOK...
We appreciate you!"


PJCM wrote:
I followed Look's instructions (posted earlier by Cleaner) for the quick fix for bearing seal stiffness with success.

The axle assemblies were easy to access with the nylon locknut for the left pedal unscrewing counter-clockwise (right hand thread) and right pedal clockwise (left hand thread).

Sliding the nylon locknut away from the bearings to access the seal revealed an angled lip that appears to cause a lot of the resistance. I applied some silicone grease to the seal and then reassembled the pedals but noticed little, if any, improvement in rotating resistance.

I opened up the pedals again and using a small flat screwdriver went around the seal lip lifting it up and then pushing it down to soften it up. This made a big difference and over several rides the pedals consistently hang upright ready for engagement.

The pedals now work perfectly, as they should have out of the box.

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Last edited by tcurtbike on Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:14 am 
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EDIT: Woops, I was supposed to press edit, not reply.

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Last edited by tcurtbike on Wed Mar 31, 2010 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Posted: Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:14 am 


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