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PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:31 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 2:20 am
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Location: Belgium
Hi,

Quote:
This is pretty much what I'm asking. Is there anything inherent in the handmade procedure that a vulcanised tyre can not achieve? Got conflicting opinions so far. And I don't mean exceeding just in any one characteristic, but with the goal of balancing grip, puncture protection and rolling resistance.


The main difference between the two is that the handmade procedure allows you to use any tread available, natural rubber (produced from latex) or synthetic. All rubber is vulcanised or it wouldn't be of any practical use for a tyre BTW.
The vulcanisation process we are referring to is the process that allows two different compounds to become permanently attached. I.e. multi-compound tyres where a different rubber is used for tread and casing.
In order to achieve this a chemical process is re-used (vulcanisation) so the various rubber compounds become an seamless one.
This is the most common procedure for industrially made tyres. Now, what sets this apart is that the rubber (synthetic in most cases nowadays) is vulcanised several times and this makes it less supple, less flexible compared to natural rubber which was only vulcanised once.
Now I'm far from being a chemical engineer but the trick is of course to formulate a rubber compound that remains flexible enough, does not cut easily, offers good grip and so on after it has been vulcanised onto the casing.
A casing that will already contain a rubber layer for the tread to vulcanise on to.

Traditional handmade tyres* (mostly tubulars) use different procedures in that the entire casing is coated in several layers of latex (which is of course not vulcanized) upon which the tread is glued. You can't (to the best of my knowledge) vulcanise onto a latex layer directly.
Now, from the description of both procedures it becomes clear that the handmade tyre will maintain a far higher amount of flexibility since the sidewalls are merely protected by latex and the least flexible part (assuming no anti-puncture belt) is the central tread.

So, logically it will take one hell of a good compound to beat the handmade tyre. Not impossible but not very obvious to achieve.
One could easily go on for days like this but I'll stop the rant right here.

*There are several ways to go about this but nowadays the procedure is grosso modo as described above.

Hope this helps, ;)

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Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:31 pm 


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 10:44 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:23 am
Posts: 306
uraqt wrote:
@ bombertodd "The first Evo CX didn't have great grip in the wet" Compared to what?

I think Vittoria is the "cream of the crop" : )

IME The open pro has always been better than other brands matching releases. It's only limit is wear for the heavy guys. Never a side wall cut and much better in the wet than any other brand.


It didn't have great grip in the wet compared to the second and third versions. I still feel the first Evo CX was a great tire overall. Although the first version still had better grip than some other tires I've ridden such as GP4000s.

I'd agree that Vittoria is is one of, if not, the cream of the crop. I really like my Veloflex Corsa's too.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 2:45 am 
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in the industry
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Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2012 2:59 pm
Posts: 612
Location: Ruidoso, NM
wassertreter wrote:
Call my a tyre nerd, but wasn't the conventional wisdom that handglued tyres were the best, and I think Jan Heine has been quoted saying the same here in this thread? Now in his blog entry about the Compass tyres, Heine says vulcanized was better, because the tread was not under tension when the tyre is inflated. I can see how a tension-free tread helps prevents (or at least limiting) cuts.


To get the tread "stress free" when inflated, wouldn't the tread need to be attached with the tire inflated? On a hand-glued tubular that is theoretically possible, but I can't imagine it happening with any clincher or vulcanized tubular.

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