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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:08 pm 
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This is just to open up conversation on what everyone thinks is the timeline for Disc brakes in road bikes, but in mass production. anyone think this will happen this year? will we see it start to ramp up in the coming months. no brand/Chinese manufactures are making them ex. FM-166 (i would not trust there forks).

we now have carbon ceramic rotors from kettle cycles that weigh 50 - 60g depending on size. Spyre SLC 141g. Sub 250g disc brakes for front and rear calipers, plus rotors.

this will allow us to use lighter rims like the ones mercury/dash have shown off - superlight 26mm wide carbon clincher 296g. that is light tubular territory, with none of the braking/heat problems.

Mercury/dash Carbon clincher for disc only
http://brimages.bikeboardmedia.netdna-c ... ites02.jpg

Zipp Disc 303
http://www.bikerumor.com/2013/04/04/zip ... ke-wheels/

Trp spyre SLC
http://cdn.mos.bikeradar.com/images/new ... 800-75.jpg

Kettle cycles SIcc
http://www.cxmagazine.com/wp-content/up ... C_0036.jpg

TRP HY/RD video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_YREtBNCkI

Specialized hydraulic disc Roubaix prototype
http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/s ... ype-36940/

Canyon Ultimate SLX disc
http://brimages.bikeboardmedia.netdna-c ... bike01.jpg

dengfu FM-166
http://dengfubikes.com/index.php?page=s ... &Itemid=69

What does everyone else think? I will keep updating this post with links to information people post on the thread.


Last edited by spytech on Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:40 pm, edited 15 times in total.

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Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:08 pm 


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:15 pm 
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I think the time is nigh, and will be absolutely shocked if we don't see a decent showing this year alongside a tidal wave in 2014. With Sram and Shimano ready to release their hydraulic levers whenever they feel like it, it's just a waiting game on frame manufacturers. Of course, frame manufacturers are likely going to wait on the UCI before doing anything large-scale, so this could all grind to a halt until road discs are race-legal.

The hubs are ready.
The discs are ready.
The levers are (almost) ready.
The calipers are (likely) ready.

It's just a waiting game on the frames.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:28 pm 
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Location: Santa Cruz, California, USA
spytech wrote:
no brand/Chinese manufactures are making them ex. FM-166 (i would not trust there forks).


Why? Chances are good you're riding on a Chinese manufactured fork now, even if it was "made" by a major brand.

The exterior layup of my FM-066 frame/fork, and what interior I can see through the various holes, look to be well built. At least to the level of my Cervelos, and the exterior is nicer, with no waviness in the outer UD layer.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:38 pm 
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I'm told on reasonable authority that those frame/forks have passed en certification, stands to reason that any disc frame/fork they make may well be sent for approval too, so I'd agree -no reason to not trust the build quality from what I've seen.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:25 pm 
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I hope so. If there was a Giant TCR Advanced disc I'd buy one tomorrow (but not in white...).

Watch out for BMC later this spring with a carbon GranFondo... :wink:


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:32 pm 
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Isn't there a much greater risk of injury with discs during the kind of pile-ups we see in the TdF etc?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:41 pm 
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Can't wait to see these in Cat 5 crit races.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:42 pm 
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Also what about the aero argument with wheels/frames? I am not by any means expert on this, but in my mind a disk beside the wheel will probably mess up the aerodynamics abilities of any wheel.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:26 pm 
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Some definitely have a production version in the wings, however having said that I really hope that it doesn't happen just yet. It's definitely not aero, the reports I've seen say it's significantly more drag than ones intuition would lead them to believe. Then of course with the new 11 speed rear ends and a disc you've got road frames with a too narrow 130 spacing. Then the biggest issue is the heat. I know most on this forum understand how to descend a mountain with proper use of brakes but then take into account that this forum certainly doesn't represent the normal cycling public who think it's ok to drag their brake down a long descent. You've also got the UCI regulations to deal with. I think just on the basis of no huge performance gain vs the fact that wheel changes take longer and the aero drag is worse the pro tour riders will resist even if the UCI makes it legal.

In my opinion disc brakes bring more problems to the table than they solve, at least on road bikes.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:36 pm 
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135mm spacing solves the 11 speed issue but then hubs in anything but 28H or 32H drilling are hard to come by.

Aero drag for the average cyclist is not much of an issue, for the elite racer then the extra drag will make some difference.

Discs brakes are most useful I think on winter bikes as rims are not worn out and wet weather braking is good. The average cyclsit will just have to learn how to use there brake properly on decents.

I will be using the N+1 rule to justify a disc brake road build this year. I just need to decide if the bike will be a winter bike or not.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:08 am 
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madcow wrote:
I know most on this forum understand how to descend a mountain with proper use of brakes but then take into account that this forum certainly doesn't represent the normal cycling public who think it's ok to drag their brake down a long descent. You've also got the UCI regulations to deal with.


I think this is probably the biggest barrier to road discs at the moment, there are many people out there who don't have a proper understanding of how to brake effectively. Though I would say from a consumer standpoint, they'd be great for the UK market due to our poor roads, inclement weather and relative lack of seriously big descents.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:22 am 
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[quote="bm0p700f" The average cyclsit will just have to learn how to use there brake properly on decents.
[/quote]

Maybe cyclists are smarter in your country but it's not going to happen in the USA. Brakes will have to be able to withstand 3000ft descents @ 25 mph with the brakes clamped on the whole way, because some people are going to ride like that.

I see this every year in the Markeeville Death Ride (125 miles, 15000' of climbing on five big passes, 3000 riders).
There's always some people for who descending at speed is too scary so they go 25 mph the whole way down each one.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:54 am 
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I certainly hope so. I'm riding an On One Dirty Disco now, but I'd like to upgrade to a road geo disc bike like the FR-320. With my road bike reserved for fair weather duty, I will never have to wipe down a rim again. Hopefully they can keep the seatstay width reasonably narrow despite the 135mm rear OLD.

Just to add: I see zero point to discs on my regular bike. Only for a winter/rain bike.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 1:15 am 
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madcow wrote:
Some definitely have a production version in the wings, however having said that I really hope that it doesn't happen just yet. It's definitely not aero, the reports I've seen say it's significantly more drag than ones intuition would lead them to believe. Then of course with the new 11 speed rear ends and a disc you've got road frames with a too narrow 130 spacing. Then the biggest issue is the heat. I know most on this forum understand how to descend a mountain with proper use of brakes but then take into account that this forum certainly doesn't represent the normal cycling public who think it's ok to drag their brake down a long descent. You've also got the UCI regulations to deal with. I think just on the basis of no huge performance gain vs the fact that wheel changes take longer and the aero drag is worse the pro tour riders will resist even if the UCI makes it legal.

In my opinion disc brakes bring more problems to the table than they solve, at least on road bikes.


@Madcow - have you seen the footage from TRP about their new HY/RD system and heat management? It shows that the system doesn't fade even after the calipers are piping red hot. Also, I would go as far as to say that test would even be improved using the SICCC disc since it's a carbon ceramic based product. I'm hoping that these manufacturers are ready and the product is good.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 1:17 am 
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with Proper set up, their is little to no brake fade... Carbon ceramic disc get better as temperature rises. if your set up is using cables then no problem - no oil boiling your oil of a hydro set up.

tharmor wrote:
Also, I would go as far as to say that test would even be improved using the SICCC disc since it's a carbon ceramic based product.


yes, they brake better with more heat!

Aero? i ride 32 hole rims, i dont really think disc will make that big of a difference, not to me. use smaller disc's with a smaller profile to minimize the aero impact. if we can get a clincher under 300g with none of the inherent problems we currently have, i call that a plus. i know some would be happy not to worry about delaminated rims.

i think the FM-066 is a good bike, i just dont trust the FM-166 Disc Fork. i have no basis for not trusting it, i just dont.

btw, here is the video to the TRP HY/RD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_YREtBNCkI" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

isn't alchemy working on disc hubs?


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