Phill P wrote:
Doesn't Merida make the top Specialized frames - not Dengfu?
deng or hung make nothing. they are just middle men. factory will not sell you just 1 frame directly. it is why you see a lot of group buys from the velobuild forums.
since everybody agrees, that these chinese oem knockoff's are getting better and better. so what can everyone agree/assume is the level of technology and overall build quality of these bikes? how close are they to the manufacturing techniques employed by the name brand companies? what name brand bikes use to be 1, 2, 3 or 5 years ago? and how close to the point of demising returns are we talking about here? how much R&D and testing went into a rue, or a crumpton, etc when they first started out or even now... how many bikes were tested to the point of break, how much design and technology, machinery, do these bikes have? dont get me wrong, i like crumpton's (except for the ones with bolted dropouts - for the money, i want full carbon, even if it made 0 difference). how many of these guys have a background in composite materials or eng.? appleman, spin, AX, dont really know of others. yet we do not question the build qualities of these bikes, we put them above the name brand bikes most of the time.
i have to agree i got a bit carried away with some things, but at the end of the day, these oem bikes, are probably 95% as good as the name brand bikes. we will have people that would like to fight that, for various reason; they bought an expensive bike or they have a stake in it. but a poster made a good analogy with Hyundai and kia cars. they just kept getting better and better to the point that they rival the top manufactures.
some of these bikes arent that cheap, if you buy an fm066 which is suppose to be 850g for a size 56 (same geometry as a caad10), it will cost $780 ($580 group buy price). that is their superlite model made out of t800 and t1000 toray fiber. but still a great deal for what you get. how many oem bikes are out there? how many people have heard of catastrophic failure with these bikes? i hear about a lot of satisfied customers. i would assume that a failure would get posted very quickly with a "warning do not buy from such and such chinese oem, my frame broke 5 miles from home". we dont really see or hear that, and it would spread like wildfires in the interweb.
subtle changes, but i think it looks good. if they dropped the alu BB for a full carbon, they could drop 30g (felt said they lost as much by doing so).
So I'd guess those knockoffs or cheaper versions are made in factories started by ex-workers for brandname manufacturers who decided they could start their own companies with the knowledge they got ?
I could be wrong, just seems more logical. It happens all the time..
Indeed. But isnt that how many of the "boutique" brands started in Europe and the US, a few key employees escaping from BigCo? Where did Dario Pegoretti learn to weld?
The real plus of buying a brand is its accountability, and hence lower risk. Better QC. Possibly a year or so competitive advantage on a "feature", which often is percieved as nothing more than marketing, before the no names copy it- examples include Dimples, Aero road bikes, ISPs, for gods sake? There is an issue when people start saying "its like comparing Gordon Ramsay to cooking it yourself" as youre trying to mystify a process which, fundamentally, doesnt have an awful lot of firm specific assets.
i just had to repost - to give props to this mallorquino. we should have a like button...lol btw, i dont like Jorge Lorenzo.
esta muy bien escrito!!!