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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 1:48 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:07 am
Posts: 4
Hi all,
I have a question about using Sapim's D-light spoke for a specific application. I've never built with the D-light spokes before, therefore I would be grateful for any advice, thoughts, experience or guidance you wheel builders might have to give.

Let me try to explain... ( speaking about the rear wheel only )
Normally when building a traditional rim brake wheel for road race use and laser spokes have been requested/chosen. I will build the non drive side with laser but use race for the drive side. My thought being that the more robust race spokes handle the forces from the drive train better than the lasers.

Since we're all WW and saving grams where you can is a noble pursuit. My question is could I use the D-light spoke in place of the race in the above application ( as more robust drive side spokes ).

I think my confusion is coming from Sapim, who seems to market the D-light as a disc-brake specific spoke. It looks to me like a "better laser" as something that can handle the torque transmissions of disc brakes should be able to handle the forces of the drive train.

I'm interested in what other people think about this.


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Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 1:48 pm 


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 7:52 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:25 pm
Posts: 1659
Location: Glermsford, Suffolk U.K
Lasers handle the torque from pedalling just fine. I ride disc brake wheels built with laser. Some DH MTB rider have CX-rays in there wheels with no issues a stiff rim helps.

D-lights are stiffer so are in prinicple better for disc brake use. You pick the spoke to suit the intended mileage of the wheel. If the wheel is going to be low mileage then lase could work well. If the wheels is going be ridden 10,000 per year then lasers would be a silly idea and a stiffer spoke would be needed.

I personally ise Sapim race spokes in a disc brake build unless it is a weight weenie build for a light rider that is not going to see mega mileage then I will build with laser spokes. D-lights are this half way house and the weight saving over race spokes is 50g for 64 not enough to worry about really.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 8:05 pm 
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DS D-Lights/NDS Lasers is a often used and recommended pattern.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 2:14 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:07 am
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bm0p700f wrote:
You pick the spoke to suit the intended mileage of the wheel. If the wheel is going to be low mileage then lase could work well. If the wheels is going be ridden 10,000 per year then lasers would be a silly idea and a stiffer spoke would be needed.


It seems, that I don't understand your meaning. You suggest that spokes should be chosen based on the intended mileage of the wheel. If we were to focus only on mileage. Then mileage can be broken down into revolutions of a wheel or rather fatigue cycles.

Sapim's fatigue cycle testing shows that Laser spokes have a higher fatigue life then stiffer spokes like the Race. CX-rays have even higher fatigue life. I'm curious about your reasons for saying that the idea of using Laser spokes on a wheel that is ridden 10k + per year is silly? I mean if I'm missing something I would like to know.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 12:51 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:25 pm
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Location: Glermsford, Suffolk U.K
Sapim's fatigue test do not make much sense as the same wire stock is used for the race spokes and laser's I do wonder how they test the spoke. The test is also misleading in much the same way the strength data is misleading suggesting the Laser is stronger than the race spoke forgeting it is UTS in N/mm^2 of course a race spoke has a higher cross sectional area so it can actually take a higher load. so ignore sapim's data.

Also fatigue of a spoke in a wheel is actually depenent on how stiff the wheel is radially, torsionally and laterally. The stiffer the wheel the less de tensioning of a spoke there is (and the less tension increase) and this reduces the ammount of fatigue the spoke seen in each cycle. So Sapim's data is misleading. Use a sapim race spoke in a wheel and the wheel will be stiffer and the spokes will last longer. sapim force spokes with the 2.3mm diameter elbow are ideal in a very high mileage low spoke count wheelset ridden in dry conditions alone. These spoke will take an age to break.

So if you are riding 10,000 miles a year in dry conditions wear rim wear is low on the wheels sapim race are the spokes to go for both sides as this increases wheel stiffness and spoke life will be increased. In the U.K rim wear is a big issue so I tend to build with lasers alot as rim can last as little as 5000 miles before they are worn through.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 4:57 pm 
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Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:03 am
Posts: 1915
Location: Islip, NY
Looks like almost the same spoke as the Wheelsmith DB14. I've used those for drive side as well.

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Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 4:57 pm 


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