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Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:11 pm
by ZeroG
I will have a full explanation on the design at a blog I have been working on which will have detailed information on the design, the changes, and the construction. I am fully aware that this this is a radical change from the previous design that we did the pre-order .. but sometimes it's right in the thick of battle that you figure out how to win the war. This design is incredible on so many fronts as it solves the all the problems I had with previous designs. The photo that was posted is a process photo and there are several elements to the design that are yet to be revealed including the the aero cover.

The most exciting thing about this design is the attachment of the tubes which do not rely on bonding nor press fit. I am taking photos of the construction process because the technically minded will appreciate the details of a radical design.

I'm almost finished with the blog and will post the address shortly.

Thanks,

Ted

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:11 pm
by Weenie

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Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:49 pm
by CarpetFibre
:popcorn:

This is entertaining to watch in many ways. I look forward to seeing what you've come up with Ted, although I will need serious persuasion to ever swap out my Claviculas.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:22 pm
by CharlesM
Interesting assumptions being made...

There are loads of alu/carbon rims around that have had no issues at all. I have a couple of sets that are 6 years old plus with several thousand miles on em and no problem.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:53 pm
by uraqt
I have said it before and will say it again!!!

Go TED GO!!!!! : )


C

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:22 pm
by elviento
However critical people are doesn't change the fact that it's great to see someone experimenting with new designs and new ideas. IMHO, this makes WW great. :thumbup:

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:28 pm
by itsacarr
+1 on one the simple fact people love to be critical - which is fine - ultimately you don't have to buy it if you don't want it but it's rad that a fellow weightweenie is making something new as a few others have done on this forum. Looking forward to reading more about it.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:29 pm
by Mattias Hellöre
Charles:
You can have an insulating layer quite easily between an alu brake track and a carbon rim.
Same thing for bonding axles and other applications on a bicycle. You have here something that is groundbreakingly light and arguably takes the highest force on a bicycle IN SHEAR.
So why is this different? Well you need to put a insulating veil between the materials. How will this veil hold up to the shear forces and how much does it weigh?
That graphite fibers produce a large galvanic potential with alu alloys (Alu is anodic to carbon) is a firm established scientific fact. This is stopped by using either CIC ( Corrosion Inhibiting Compounds) or sometimes a sacrificing anode. Please note:
It matters not one iota if the materials are bonded, pressed or kept together w pixie dust.
So I guess the question is: How is this done here?
Quite a few composite tubing manufacturers also specifically cautions against the use of alu with carbon composites..


Source:
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aeromagazine/aero_07/corrosn.html

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:27 pm
by RichTheRoadie
A link from Boeing... An industry where corrosion will be no doubt accelerated due to the constant changes in altitude, air pressure and speed; not to mention the massive differences in speed over a bicycle.

Can we stop speculating until we know the facts?

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:42 pm
by Mattias Hellöre
The laws of physics apply to bikes and planes at all speeds and altitudes...
If you had read through the paper instead of rushed to the keyboard you would have noticed that it mostly applies to non load bearing structures inside the craft. A very highly controlled environment indeed.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:52 pm
by RichTheRoadie
I have no interest in reading the paper - all I am saying is lets wait to hear exactly what is going on here before drawing conclusions.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:22 pm
by artray
I don't understand why Ted has not made a comment on the corrosion issues . Its no good sticking a aero cover on and hoping it will not happen. Why can't the design be all carbon?
Mattias is only making valid point based on fact and what he has seen so far and I agree with him .
Lets hope the crank turns out to be a beauty but it does still seem early days . I did like the original first design. I wonder why we had such a radical 2nd design ? who knows whats next . :popcorn:

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:07 pm
by styrrell
Its not that galvanic corrosion isn't a concern, but geez, most people with carbon cranks (which on ww is most people) have carbon / al bonding. Not to mention the fork ends, dropouts on carbon frames, BB shells, etc.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:08 pm
by Mackers
Right about now is when I would be calling my credit card company to get my deposit back, had I taken Ciamillo up on their pre-launch offer.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:56 am
by spud
a basic problem with this design is the structure is not moved as far as possible from the neutral axis. The fairing mentioned is where all the structure should be, as it would result in structural material at the outer edges of the physical envelope, which makes a more efficient structure (strength/weight).

This is the whole reason Shimano developed hollow forgings, and Cannondale developed the Si machined/bonded cranks. And neither of those cranks has to deal with mechanical, high stress interfaces between dissimilar materials.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:07 am
by diesel
These are crazy looking cranks. This looks like an idea that could be ran with. I wonder if they can make a very tough cover that is ballistic material. I think I will wait for the second round.

Re: Ciamillo carbon crank now with pre-launch offer informat

Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:07 am
by Weenie

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