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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 4:32 pm 
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I am just throwing this out there, I know it's a ways away but do you guys think I will be able to use the new 11 speed shimano cassette with my lw std 3 wheel set? Currently you can switch the freehub from shimano to campy 11 speed with no problems I wonder if it will work for shimano.


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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 4:32 pm 


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:20 pm 
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There is no real way of knowing until it comes out but they haven't changed the spacing (yet) from 130 so I would say you are OK.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 6:41 pm 
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I am not sure if I have read your question correctly, but you might like to note that with Campag both 9, 10 and 11 speed cassettes fit onto the same freehub body. It would be a bummer if the new 11 speed Shimano sprockets did not fit on the current Shimano 10 speed freehub body.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:28 pm 
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Valbrona wrote:
I am not sure if I have read your question correctly, but you might like to note that with Campag both 9, 10 and 11 speed cassettes fit onto the same freehub body. It would be a bummer if the new 11 speed Shimano sprockets did not fit on the current Shimano 10 speed freehub body.


11sp shimano is still just a rumor. BUT the rumor say just that the new 11sp shimano body is wider, 10sp cassette will work with a spacers. but it will not work the other way. so IF the RUMOR is true, i personally would´t count on that Ufgators wheelset would take 11sp body


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:31 pm 
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What a bummer!


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:53 pm 
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JensW wrote:
Valbrona wrote:
I am not sure if I have read your question correctly, but you might like to note that with Campag both 9, 10 and 11 speed cassettes fit onto the same freehub body. It would be a bummer if the new 11 speed Shimano sprockets did not fit on the current Shimano 10 speed freehub body.


11sp shimano is still just a rumor. BUT the rumor say just that the new 11sp shimano body is wider, 10sp cassette will work with a spacers. but it will not work the other way. so IF the RUMOR is true, i personally would´t count on that Ufgators wheelset would take 11sp body


Hmm so I may have to consider campy for 11 speed?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:21 pm 
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Ufgators wrote:
JensW wrote:
Valbrona wrote:
I am not sure if I have read your question correctly, but you might like to note that with Campag both 9, 10 and 11 speed cassettes fit onto the same freehub body. It would be a bummer if the new 11 speed Shimano sprockets did not fit on the current Shimano 10 speed freehub body.


11sp shimano is still just a rumor. BUT the rumor say just that the new 11sp shimano body is wider, 10sp cassette will work with a spacers. but it will not work the other way. so IF the RUMOR is true, i personally would´t count on that Ufgators wheelset would take 11sp body


Hmm so I may have to consider campy for 11 speed?


if 11sp is so important, yes. BUT i´m not sure that i would base a decision on a rumor. it looks like there will be a 11sp shimano group, but we don´t know for sure what will be different


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:39 pm 
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From what SuperDave (Felt's road brand manager) on Slowtwitch has been saying, the hub specs have been provided to them, other manufacturers, and other wheel/hub manufacturers. Unfortunately we consumers obviously have no idea what will be different and what needs to be accounted for.
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/gforum.cgi? ... st=3669927


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:38 pm 
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Valbrona wrote:
I am not sure if I have read your question correctly, but you might like to note that with Campag both 9, 10 and 11 speed cassettes fit onto the same freehub body. It would be a bummer if the new 11 speed Shimano sprockets did not fit on the current Shimano 10 speed freehub body.


That's not entirely correct - lots of freehub and frame designs had problems with 11s initially. Ironically, often solved by using a Shimano 10s spacer, though not always.

If the LW uses the DT freehub, then hopefully any revised DT freehub will be able to be swapped in.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:11 am 
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musket wrote:
Valbrona wrote:
I am not sure if I have read your question correctly, but you might like to note that with Campag both 9, 10 and 11 speed cassettes fit onto the same freehub body. It would be a bummer if the new 11 speed Shimano sprockets did not fit on the current Shimano 10 speed freehub body.


That's not entirely correct - lots of freehub and frame designs had problems with 11s initially. Ironically, often solved by using a Shimano 10s spacer, though not always.

If the LW uses the DT freehub, then hopefully any revised DT freehub will be able to be swapped in.


The only way a current wheel can allow for Shimano 11 speed is if there is room to move the inboard cassette cog another ~1.8mm. For most hubs this space has been used to maximize spoke angle and deduce dish although there are some from Campagnolo/Fulcrum with their huge drive side hub flanges and 2:1 rear spoke lacing that have some spacer.

Others, like MAVIC; already use a wider-than-needed freehub that requires a spacer for 10 speed.

Sadly, in the case of the Shimano hubs/wheels, DT stock hubs, Zipp freehubs, and many others, a new wheel (and possible redesign) is required.

-SD

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:26 am 
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Location: Queensland, Australia
Hi all, I have been chasing info wrt DA11 compatibility for Chris King & DT Swiss Hubs.

DT Swiss have responded to say all 2013 DT Swiss hubs will be DA11 compatible and a DA11 adaptor kit for earlier hubs (? new freehub body & shortened cap at NDS end) will be available after Eurobike.

There is a supposed DT schematic that might be correct on http://www.bikerumor.com/2012/05/01/11-speed-road-bike-hubs-versus-10-speed-tech-breakdown/ that is consistent with this, and pictures on http://www.bikeradar.com/road/news/article/dt-swiss-and-schwalbe-2013-road-products-launch-34116/ of the 2013 hubs. Information has varied but it does seem possible that the hub width (OLN) has increased to 131 mm, but either way the hub flanges have to be "rejigged" slightly to the NDS to allow for the longer freehub body. This is more of a problem for manufacturers when the flanges & hub shell are one-piece, or there aren't swappable freehub bodies.

Chris King info was harder to get, but finally (from their marketing dept):
"The new Shimano 11spd system requires some changes to current rear hub designs to allow for the increased length of the splines for cassettes. To be compatible with Shimano 11spd, Chris King R45, Classic, and Cross 130mm hubs will require a new, longer driveshell and a new axle to properly position the hub with the new driveshell. In addition, built wheels will need to be re-dished a few millimeters. Chris King hubs updated with 11spd will be reverse compatible with 8,9, and 10spd systems by using a spacer placed behind the cassette."

Hope this helps,

Bikelife


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:34 am 
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Anyone knows the reasons behind this ?
Campagnolo 11spd can be made to work on pretty much any wheel out there without requiring a adapter or new hub, redish, or let alone a new wheel.
Has Shimano designed their 11spd cogs spaced further apart than Campagnolo ?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:14 pm 
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Assume they make the hub body a little wider and the cap a little narrower. That will move the 11 tooth cog a little more toward the frame. It might be somewhere between a mm or two.

Now with compact rings, if you’re in the 34 x 11 won’t the chain hit the lift pins on the 50 ring. The reason I ask, I have seen this happen now with different rings. I have never understood why it happens. I have been told that different hub manufactures can place the hub body in different places on the hub as things are now. That never made sense to me.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:44 pm 
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Bikelife wrote:
Hi all, I have been chasing info wrt DA11 compatibility for Chris King & DT Swiss Hubs.



I just received an email back from White Industries:

"We will be introducing a new 11 speed compatible hub in September.  The
current H3 hub is not compatible."

Mark

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:57 pm 
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Location: Wet coast, Canada
Good info Bikelife.

Ironically, I bet the King R45 Campy compatible hub will be easily converted to Shimano 11 with just a freehub swap. The current R45 Campy has center to DS flange = 17.1 mm while the current R45 Shimano has center to DS flange = 18.9 mm. So there is the magic 1.8mm of extra length.


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Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:57 pm 


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