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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 4:51 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2011 4:10 pm
Posts: 273
My experiences running 36 / 52 with a red crank:

36/52 SRAM Red rings are pretty bad. I can swap out to my specialized s-works rings, and get much better shifting. The stronglight CT2s are pretty similar shifting, but seem slightly worse - that may be a placebo effect of never running them on my allez though.

Old Red front derailleur is finicky to setup, and the ti cage is subject to wear. Force/rival shifts better. This is somewhat dependent on the frame though: my aluminum allez is a lot more precise on the front than the s-works tarmac sl3, even with the same crankset/ derailleurs. I should probably run the s-works crank on the tarmac, but the colors on the cranks match the bikes perfectly, and look moronic when swapped.

so configurations I've used with 36/52, rated from best to worst shifting: Both bikes are using old Sram Red levers (Allez is black, the Tarmac LTE if that matters)

good: (the configuration I currently run)
Tarmac w/ red crank/ stronglight CT2 rings and yaw red fd:
Allez w/ s-works crank/rings and force fd:

Acceptable:
Tarmac w/ s-works crank/rings and force fd:
Tarmac w/ red crank/ s-works rings and force fd
Tarmac w/ red crank/ stronglight rings and force fd

Marginal:
Allez w/ s-works crank/ red rings and force fd
Allez w/ red crank/rings and force fd

Bad shifting.
Tarmac w/ s-works crank/ red rings and force fd:
Tarmac w/ red crank/rings and force fd:.
Tarmac w/ red crank/rings and old red fd

My recommendation would be to buy a set of Stronglight CT2 rings and a Yaw front derailleur. The rings alone would make the shifting much better, but the new yaw derailleur adds quite a bit. You might try just the yaw derailleur though, as it may be enough to make you happy.


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Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 4:51 pm 


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 4:55 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:19 am
Posts: 793
Great feedback, thanks very much :beerchug:


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 5:39 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:33 am
Posts: 215
Thanks - the 695 has a carbon derailleur hanger in front so it seems to be a little flexy, especially with that much pressure from the cable tension and doesn't always shift amazing. I've been working with it for a long time and have gotten it in a satisfactory state, but I don't always trust it. I have Red on another bike with a metal hanger which shifts much better.


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 9:22 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2011 7:39 pm
Posts: 26
My Supersix Evo came with the 2011 Sram red group, I had my LBS replace the FD with a new one from Sram (An acknowledged problem) with a steel cage, I upgraded to a DA chain and I added Praxis Works chain rings. Still using the stock Red shifters. My front shifting is flawless and quick, super happy now!


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2012 12:57 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 10:21 pm
Posts: 436
Location: NJ, USA
I run sram red with the red steel front derailleur and 2012 crankset. Old red front shifting with ti front and old red cranks would be like a 5 out of 10, with steel front derailleur like 7 out of 10, now with the new crankset like a 9 out of 10, and my gxp crankset weighed in at 603 grams. The shifting is faster and smoother up front now.


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2012 3:40 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:19 am
Posts: 793
I didn't think you could run the new crank without additional equipment?


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2012 3:46 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:19 am
Posts: 793
Nevermind, that velonews article just answered my question. Looks like it's time for some new RED!




...now if I can just find some "spare" money


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2012 3:57 pm 
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in the industry

Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:59 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
Wcl4 - Check your chain. If you're running a SRAM chain you will not get the fastest shifting on your Praxis forged LOOK ZED rings. We highly suggest running a KMC/Shimano/Campy chains.

Adam@Praxis
Manufacturer
Santa Cruz County, CA

_________________
Praxis Works
Manufacturer
Santa Cruz, CA
www.praxis-works.com


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2012 4:00 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 29, 2009 4:30 pm
Posts: 1501
The 2011 Red FD uses a tiotanium cage, which is not as stiff as steel. Others have noted that the shifting is poor and switched to FORCE FD (steel) for an improvement.
I don't have any Red, but I have been running entirely Force and my front shifting is OK.
I switched from Force chainrings recently to new Red Black chainrings (50/34) and they shift no different. (shift fine)
I have run Force, DA 7800, DA7900, and the KMC DX10SL chains with little difference in shifting performance.


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2012 4:09 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:33 am
Posts: 215
AptosBigRing wrote:
Wcl4 - Check your chain. If you're running a SRAM chain you will not get the fastest shifting on your Praxis forged LOOK ZED rings. We highly suggest running a KMC/Shimano/Campy chains.

Adam@Praxis
Manufacturer
Santa Cruz County, CA


Great to know. Thanks!


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2012 7:38 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2011 8:09 pm
Posts: 698
I used to think the shifting of my Red FD with titanium cage was good. Then I switched to a Red Black FD with Steel cage. Shifting is really fast and crisp now. I also run QRings, works great.


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PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2012 6:59 am 
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Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:19 pm
Posts: 66
I am on week 3 and 200km with my 2012 SRAM Red hybrid set up. I run my own company, have two young boys, and also swim 4.8 km per week, so I have to balance my work and various play times accordingly.

My new bike is the Lynskey Helix OS.

A couple of observations:

1) The SRAM Red Aeroglide brakes are absolutely fantastic with my custom-built HED C2 rimmed wheels - so much so that I cancelled the eeBrakes that I had on order. Previous SRAM Red brakes did not work well with wider rimmed wheels but these new brakes were made to work with the wide rimmed Zipp Firecrest wheels (no surprise since Zipp and SRAM are the same company now). I believe that this is the sleeper component of the new 2012 SRAM Red groupset.

2) I use the SRAM Red YAW FD clamp with the SRAM Red FD with the chain catcher. The old SRAM FD clamp is not the same as the new SRAM Red YAW FD clamp. I had them side by side and my bike mechanic tried both for comparisons sake. I think this might be an overlooked reason why front shifting of the previous SRAM Red FD was less than perfect. Yes, set up is critical. Yes, the titanium-caged SRAM Red FD might have been flexy. Yes, the Sram Red chainring and crankset might not have been the stiffest. Yes, the new steel/aluminium-caged SRAM Red Yaw FD might be stiffer. Yes, I also have the steel-caged SRAM Red FD for comparisons sake. But, for a lot bikes that have on-bike FD clamp/brackets, I think that these on-bike FD clamp/brackets might not have been the best connecting points for the SRAM Red FD that come as a braze-on unit. So, my recommendation is to use the SRAM Red YAW FD clamp with the SRAM Red FD. Btw, I am using the Cannondale Hollowgram SISL 50/34 170mm crankset. I also have the SRAM Red Exogram 53/39 170mm crank in a box (bought the whole groupset for a nice discount). So for front shifting - perfect, quick, no-hesitation with the double-tap SRAM Red Ergodynamic brake/shifters. No chain rub with the big-big ring but I have not had the opportunity to try the small-small combination.

3) I am using the complete SRAM Red set up for the rear dérailleur: SRAM Red Aeroglide RD, SRAM Red X-Dome 11/23 XG1090 cassette, and SRAM Red PC-1091R chain. Shifting with the SRAM Red Ergodynamic brake/shifters is perfect. Exact actuation works - shifting up and down is immediate. No chain rub and the drivetrain is quiet. The cassette is quiet. The whole drivetrain is amazingly quiet, compared to old SRAM Red. I was riding next to Shimano Dura-Ace and Campagnolo Record-equipped bikes and we could hold a conversation while going at 20 mph. We were all at about the same noise level - perhaps Shimano and Campagnolo might have been slightly quieter but not by much. Of course, the silence was broken by the clunk/clunk shifting of my SRAM-equipped bike. But, the SRAM exact actuation was much, much faster. We tried synchronising the start of our shifting - SRAM Red was immediate up and down with a clunk/clunk announcement. Shimano took about a half-second later and was so quiet - so much so that my friend said he would only know there was a shift after his pedalling got easier or harder with the cadence change. I shifted under light load a bunch of times - 4% grade - and everything was okay. I shifted under a sprint to 45 kmh and everything was okay but a bit louder. Yes, there was the loud clunk-clunk shifting that SRAM is known for.

But, I have to admit that the smoothest and best-balance drivetrain groupset was the Campagnolo Record - like butter.

That's it for now - if this thread is still active in a month or two when I past a 1000 km, I will post another update.

Cheers.

Mark

_________________
2012 Lynskey R330 with SRAM Red Quarq
2013 Parlee Z1 with DA 9070
2013 Lynskey Helix OS II with SRAM Red


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2012 5:36 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:19 am
Posts: 793
Thank you very much for the informative post!


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