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Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?
http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=102339
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Author:  xrs2 [ Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

Anyone here tried tubeless with Enve or any other brand of carbon clinchers? I've been looking all over for information, but all the results are for Enve's mountain bike rims.

Author:  Weenie [ Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?


Author:  Frankie - B [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

Sounds like a Lemming action to me although it probably could be done. I think it will not hold air like a tubeless tire should.

Author:  dereksmalls [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

Email Enve directly and ask them. I did, but can't find the email though. They said they haven't done it, but they have heard of people doing it but they didn't have any recommendations on doing it or not.

Author:  ultyguy [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

Corima makes a tubeless carbon clincher. Cyclingweekly or someone did a review and liked it.

Author:  natiedean24 [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

These guys have converted a Zipp 404 Firecrest CC to tubeless:

http://nyvelocity.com/content/equipment ... -clinchers

Author:  aaric [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

I'd be skeptical - tubeless generally puts higher stressed on the bead. There have been issues with carbon clinchers and heat buildup with braking. I'd think that you'd be more likely to have failures with higher stresses on the bead.

Have you looked at the Dura-ace C24 TLs? Alumimum brake track and tire bed, with carbon above them. Great ride quality, carbon look, shimano durability. Only downside is the 1450g weight.

Author:  CerveloMikey [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

aaric wrote:
I'd be skeptical - tubeless generally puts higher stressed on the bead. There have been issues with carbon clinchers and heat buildup with braking. I'd think that you'd be more likely to have failures with higher stresses on the bead.

Have you looked at the Dura-ace C24 TLs? Alumimum brake track and tire bed, with carbon above them. Great ride quality, carbon look, shimano durability. Only downside is the 1450g weight.


I have three sets of DA Roadtubeless wheels. Three punctures in six years by thumbtacks or bailing wire. No pinch flats. I just bought a set of Reynolds Assaults and suffered a pinch flat with only 278 miles on them.

I am going to get Stan's yellow tape and stems and convert the Assaults to tubeless eventually.

Remember tubeless setups run much lower pressure than the standard tube setup and the Hutchinson tires have a carbon bead to prevent the tire from blowing off the rim. I run the Assaults at 120 psi / 8 Bar with Specialized Turbo tires. I run the DA wheels at 90-100 psi / 6-7 Bar. I weigh 215 lbs.

I have questioned many carbon clincher manufactures and they all say it can be done but none will give their official seal of approval. Stan is the same way, stating they have done several but nothing more than that.

I too worry about heat build up, tires blowing off the bead and all the catastrophic things that can happen in a group ride or bombing down Angeles Crest.

I guess I will have to do the conversion and do solo flat rides close to home until I feel certain that the system is safe.

Author:  natiedean24 [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

aaric wrote:
I'd be skeptical - tubeless generally puts higher stressed on the bead. There have been issues with carbon clinchers and heat buildup with braking. I'd think that you'd be more likely to have failures with higher stresses on the bead.
.


Nah. Tubeless doesn't put any more force on a rim bead than tubed. In reality, since most people ride tubeless setups with lower pressure, the force will be lower.

Author:  aaric [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

natiedean24 wrote:
Nah. Tubeless doesn't put any more force on a rim bead than tubed. In reality, since most people ride tubeless setups with lower pressure, the force will be lower.


Perhaps...but after reading of the significant spoke tension changes on wheel builds using stan's tubeless rims as the tires are inflated, I am definitely skeptical. But, I admittedly am a bit conservative with my wheel choices, as evidenced by riding 7900 C24 TLs ;)

Author:  yeaitsdave [ Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

I'd be skeptical only because of the degradation of the carbon from the sealant. It's been a bit of an issue with Stan's sealant eating some tires (while they don't disclose the ingredients, there's rumor of ammonia being in it). The newer stuff is supposed "eco friendly" and doesn't have the same issues, but I'd still be cautious with the possibility of a carbon rim degrading.

Author:  natiedean24 [ Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:26 am ]
Post subject:  Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

Oh come on. Sealant isn't going to do a thing to carbon.

Author:  jdp211 [ Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:59 am ]
Post subject:  Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

CerveloMikey wrote:
aaric wrote:
I'd be skeptical - tubeless generally puts higher stressed on the bead. There have been issues with carbon clinchers and heat buildup with braking. I'd think that you'd be more likely to have failures with higher stresses on the bead.

Have you looked at the Dura-ace C24 TLs? Alumimum brake track and tire bed, with carbon above them. Great ride quality, carbon look, shimano durability. Only downside is the 1450g weight.


I have three sets of DA Roadtubeless wheels. Three punctures in six years by thumbtacks or bailing wire. No pinch flats.

You do realize that it's not possible to pinch a tubeless setup right?

Author:  grover [ Sat Apr 28, 2012 3:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

You can pinch flat a tubeless setup. If you hit hard enough you split the bead/sidewall just above the rim.

Author:  maddog 2 [ Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

I've run various rims as tubeless but not carbon. Personally, I wouldn't worry about bead strength or anything like that but I might be concerned about taping up the rim so it's airtight. natiedean24's article mentions that the Zipp conversion needed:

Quote:
It took a lot of experimenting, but I eventually found that you need to tape up the rim with Stan’s 25mm MTB tape instead of their standard road 21mm tape. The rim bed on these wheels are textured and Stan's tape won't make a seal against it. The wider tape creeps up the sides and makes a seal against the tire bead.


... basically it sounds like he used the tape as a kind of rimstrip, rather than just seal off the spoke holes. The tape goes right up the side and seals against the tyre bead itself. Interesting. I guess it depends on how smooth the carbon is ai the rim well, as to whether you could get a decent seal.

Author:  jdp211 [ Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?

grover wrote:
You can pinch flat a tubeless setup. If you hit hard enough you split the bead/sidewall just above the rim.

That's not "pinching" in the traditional sense. Thats a tire blowing out

Author:  Weenie [ Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Road tubeless with carbon clinchers?


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