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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:48 pm 
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My new Moots RSL will have a Press Fit 30. I have had a lot of advice about the relative merits of Press Fit 30 vs a standard threaded bb, but that's not what this thread is about. The decision to go Press Fit 30 is made.

I would however like some advice about chainset options. I was going to transfer the Super Record Ti chainset from my current setup using Press Fit 30 adapters (46mm diameter). However, I am also thinking about the Cannondale Hollowgram. Is it possible to use this standard BB30 setup in a Press Fit 30 bottom bracket? I know that a standard BB30 has a 42mm diameter, but is there an adapter available or am I just asking for trouble? The beauty of the Campagnolo Press Fit 30 cups is that the bearings spin inside them, so should creak less that models where the bearings mount directly into the bb.

Will I really notice a difference in weight, performance or stiffness in going for the Cannondale over the Super Record Ti?

I will be using Super Record EPS, so aesthetically I guess that the Super Record Ti will 'go' better, but I am talking about performance here. I have a home for the Super Record Ti chainset on another bike, so this isn't a financial decision either.


Last edited by solarider on Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:48 pm 


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 2:47 pm 
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I know the SISL is a great crankset but you are not giving up too much performance by going with SR Ti either. Plus all SR + SISL feels just weird (refined look v. industrial look). Vote goes to SR Ti with a 80-20 preference ratio (yeah, I made this thing up;-)).

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:02 pm 
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If you do a search on Google, you will find that lots of people on this forum and others have had problems with BB30 creaking alot and have tried without success to make it stop. Not sure of the reasons why some have this problem and others don't.


Last edited by bones on Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:24 pm 
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i think you will find far fewer complaints about the PF30 vs. non-pressfit versions. I had LOTS of issues with my first supersix frame's standard BB30, which turned out to be a combination of the substandard cannondale ceramic bearings, and a BB30 shell that was out of spec. I think manufacturers have gotten better at using the BB30 setup in carbon frames, and PF30 is part of that improvement (since it can eliminate some of the bearing shell tolerance issues).

The standard BB30 setup in my CAAD10 was trouble free.

I have not seen a lot of complaints specifically about the PF30 flavor of BB30, but it could be selective reading on my part? Hopefully not, since I'll be building up my supersix evo this week (hopefully) that is PF30.

bones wrote:
If you do a search on Google, you will find that lots of people on this forum and others have had problems with BB30 creaking alot and have trained without success to make it stop. Not sure of the reasons why some have this problem and others don't.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:32 pm 
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Quote:
I have had a lot of advice about the relative merits of Press Fit BB30 vs a standard threaded bb, but that's not what this thread is about. The decision to go Press Fit 30 is made.


As I said. For better or for worse, I am going for Press Fit 30. I did a lot of pros and cons weighing up before I pushed the button. I just wondered whether to go for the Cannondale Hollowgram, or standard Super Record Ti.

It would appear that the Super Record Ti option is better because the cups not the bearings themselves press into the shell, eliminating a potential source of movement and therefore noise. The bearings spin in the cups, not in the frame. The cups in a Press Fit 30 are thicker and fixed, whereas the bearing races in a BB30 are thinner, and more inherently flexible since they are really only there to encase the bearings and rely on the frame's bb shell for rigidity. The Press Fit 30 cups provide this rigidity themselves.

In theory, there is no wear on the Campagnolo Press Fit 30 cups, so they won't need to be removed and reseated as often as BB30 bearings, which must lead to some sloppiness over time.

Think it will be Super Record Ti for me then. Also looks better IMHO, and there isn't that much of a weight difference.


Last edited by solarider on Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:41 pm 
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the number of problem reports on the internet about X is not much use unless you also know...

the total population of X
how many times the owner of the problematic X it is posting about it
how many non-owners are just repeating what they read on the internet
whether the owner of X was correctly using/installing/whatever it

i've got bb30, bearings go direct into the shell (steel), no creak, which proves exactly as much about bb30 as posts from people saying their's creak, i.e. nothing

bb30: if it creaks, something was made wrong, installed wrong, or is worn/damaged


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:51 pm 
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Quote:
bb30: if it creaks, something was made wrong, installed wrong, or is worn/damaged


+1, applied to most situations really, unless there is an inherent design or physical fault, which there doesn't seem to be with BB30.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 4:25 pm 
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sola, I disagree on your point above.

There's not so much a design 'fault' with bb30, rather it's got a lot to do with the tolerances. Which are simply very, very tight.

PF30 is (relatively) a lot less so, hence why (in my experience in the industry) there's less issues with it.

fwiw I am another who had noise with bb30 and Campag, again due to the design of bb30, the Campag adapter cups, amount of purchase and the play that can result. Locktite and all.

So one less mystical internet figure who had issues, if you will.


I also altered the thread name to make a little more descriptive. As this topic has been discussed before, but not in isolation to a Campag cranks only reference. Search will bring up a heap more info :thumbup:

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 4:28 pm 
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hello see here, i've the same bike as you, and using the PFBB30 ceramic + Hollowgram it works great with no issues at all. been riding it for 5 months now and still no noise or what so ever front BB place.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=88811" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

last week i pass to SR 11, and leave the cannondale MKV, and they are working great, much better than the RED setup i had, front passages much but much better.

if you go with Hollowgram that can't be wrong.

Best regards


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 4:41 pm 
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solarider wrote:
It would appear that the Super Record Ti option is better because the cups not the bearings themselves press into the shell, eliminating a potential source of movement and therefore noise. The bearings spin in the cups, not in the frame. The cups in a Press Fit BB30 are thicker and fixed, whereas the bearing races in a BB30 are thinner, and more inherently flexible since they are really only there to encase the bearings and rely on the frame's bb shell for rigidity. The Press Fit BB30 cups provide this rigidity themselves.

What exactly is your frame BB? It is either BB30 or PF30 and they are not the same.
If it is PF30, then you don't press bearings right against the frame in any case. If you plan on using a BB30 crank with it, then there is a plastic cup with a bearing inside it which is pressed into the frame. It means your SR "advantage" is kind of invalid, because you get some sort of cup in either case.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 5:48 pm 
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Quote:
My new Moots RSL will have a Press Fit 30


The clue is in the first line of the original post.

Looks like the Press Fit 30 with Hollowgram might be an option. Thanks all for the info.

Next question which I am guessing can't be answered by anybody based on personal experience just yet - is there enough room in the bb shell for the Campagnolo EPS wires (3 of them) with a Press Fit 30 BB30 bb in place?

At least with the Press Fit 30 adaptors the size of the Super Record Ti axel allows plenty of room. The Press Fit 30 BB30 bb on the other hand seems to occupy most of the available space in there.


Last edited by solarider on Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:14 pm 
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solarider wrote:
Quote:
My new Moots RSL will have a Press Fit BB30


The clue is in the first line of the original post.

Well, it's not a clue - it's a mess. There is no such standard as "Press Fit BB30" - it's either Pressfit 30 (PF30) or BB30.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:25 pm 
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solarider wrote:
Quote:
Next question which I am guessing can't be answered by anybody based on personal experience just yet - is there enough room in the bb shell for the Campagnolo EPS wires (3 of them) with a Press Fit BB30 BB30 bb in place?

I can probably take a stab at this. If you go with the standard type of PF-30 like the SRAM below, as you can see the shell of the assembly will be a problem.

Image

On the other hand, if you use Cannondale's SRM PressFit 30 bottom bracket kit which uses two individual alloy bearing cups, then I think you will find there is more space for what you want to do.

Image

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:34 pm 
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slyboots - Play nicely or don't play at all. I have asked for help precisely because I am new to this. If I was as expert as you, I wouldn't be asking, now would I? Forgive my ignorance just as I forgive your arrogance. I have revised the posts for accuracy, although every other respondent seemed to get what I was asking without the need to be such a pedant.

ms6073 - Thanks for that. I thought exactly the same about the SRAM all in one unit, and the individual bearings with adaptors seem to be the root cause of quite a few problems. Minimising the number of non-moving parts that interface seems to be the best way forward, hence probably the original Campagnolo route. Without EPS, I think Hollowgram using the more bulky bb would have been best.


Last edited by solarider on Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:36 pm 
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There you have it. There are a HUGE number of people out there that have unresolved issues with creakiness, noise, etc. with their BB30s and PF30s! Both! Go ahead google it and see for yourself!


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Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:36 pm 


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