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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:41 am 
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Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:36 am
Posts: 7
Hi guys,

I am building my first custom wheelset and in need of advice on hubs and Rims.

Basically i am looking at either

Rims : Kinlin XR 300 or 380 (Is there a big difference in terms of aerodynamic?)

Hubs : Tune Tune MAG 150 rear and Tune MIG 45 Road Front Hub (read about durability issues)

- Alchemy ELF Front Road Hub and Alchemy ORC Rear Road Hub
- Chris King R45 Road Racing Rear/Front hub

Any advise on these hubs Pros/Cons would be deeply appreciated.

Spokes - Sapim CX-Ray Spoke and Alloy nipples

Skewers - Titanium skewers. No preference

I am 72kg and ride 3 times a week for a 60-70km each ride.

Hope to hear any advice from riders.
thanks alot!

ride safe!


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:55 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2010 4:26 am
Posts: 610
This should give you all the info you need. That list looks pretty widely varied across the weight spectrum. Any reason you listed those hubs?
http://fairwheelbikes.com/forum/viewtop ... =65&t=6940" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


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Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:55 am 


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:11 am 
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jdp211 wrote:
This should give you all the info you need. That list looks pretty widely varied across the weight spectrum. Any reason you listed those hubs?
http://fairwheelbikes.com/forum/viewtop ... =65&t=6940" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Thanks for your reply. I listed the hubs mainly from recommendations from friends and some reading up in the forums. And also basically the price range i guess.
Just wondering which combination would be the best based on my riding style. I am rather new to this thus seeking advice from more experienced riders.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:32 am 
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gotcha, they're all great hubs. What is the terrain you typically ride? Road quality? Kings are fantastic, but at a weight penalty.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:45 am 
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jdp211 wrote:
gotcha, they're all great hubs. What is the terrain you typically ride? Road quality? Kings are fantastic, but at a weight penalty.


Mostly flats... Not much hills where i ride... even if there are, they aren't very high LOL.
Any thoughts on the Alchemy?


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 2:08 pm 
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Quote:
Kinlin XR 300 or 380 (Is there a big difference in terms of aerodynamic?)


You won't feel a great deal of aero benefit from a shallow rim depth at > 40mm. Granted there is something there but it won't be huge & you won't see massive minutes cut away from your regular 70km training runs. You might perceive something on the 40mm but you'd probably feel more by alternating to latex tubes vs. butyl & running a fresh set of nice tires at correct psi.

The number of spokes will play a greater affect on how the wheel grabs the wind & thus how effectively your cutting through the wind rather than wasting energy overcoming it.

One of the down sides to kinlin rims is the narrow width of the rim bed (the inside width that is where the tire will be retained) - you will end up with a rather bulbous shaped tire when using 23mm or wider tire widths. Personally I always found these narrower rims rather twitchy when cornering & I am a close weight to you @ >75kg.

You said in later posts that you don't ride in the hills too much so weight should be less of an issue vs. better aero.

Given the current offerings of rims I would be considering alpha340s, velocity a23 or hplusson archetype if your intention is to go with alu clincher. Or spend more & looking at carbon rims / tubulars. You can mix up the spoke counts on any of those alu clincher rims and get a surprisingly nice ride out of them (the lighter alpha rim will need more spokes comparatively to the higher weight ones given your weight).

Quote:
Spokes - Sapim CX-Ray Spoke and Alloy nipples


Consider brass nips for drive side rear. They hold higher tension better & are more reliable to work with over time.

Depending on rim depth, the benefits of cx-ray spokes might not be too prevalent. You could get to a good weight by mixing dt revs for the front & non-drive side & then using a standard double butted spoke (dt comps) on the rear drive side. The big weight reduction will be made by selecting a blend of spokes at the right number. Say 20h front & 24h or 28h rear - which is trading off something like 150g against a traditional 32h/32h wheel build.

All these issues are discussed at length & with a full explanation within the wheelbuilding thread (viewtopic.php?f=3&t=74564" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) - you just need some patience to read through it.


Hubs

Entirely up to you really on how much you want to spend & what target weight you're aiming for. The mix of hubs you've listed out suggests you haven't really decided one way or another if you want an out & out low weight hub, something spendy & high end or something low maintenance & durable. Generally the lower weight the hub, the more you trade off on reliability.

Tune hubs have had bad press back about 4yrs ago now. The more recent iterations of their hubs have seen good developments & excellent (imo) sizing of flanges & widths of shell which make them an interesting hub to consider. Certainly at your weight & if you have a punch style of riding you may benefit from a rear wheel build that benefits from good flange sizing & placement. The key thing for tune hubs atm is to buy them from somewhere that will stand by the warranty as it was the aftersales service that made the problems quite notorious at the time.

A big spend on hubs really isn't necessary though - stuff like circus monkey hubs (or one of the many other offerings out there) are relatively low weight & can be had for a bargain price. When you factor in hubs at > $100 price tags you suddenly switch from spending serious money to buying a wheelset that is balancing price, weight & ride characteristics far more evenly vs. high end wheelsets from a few years ago.


Ideally you should talk to a local builder that is known to be experienced & open to options being brought to the table - that way you can talk through the pros & cons of the options & also let your key requirements be worked through so a balanced decision is arrived at.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:44 pm 
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Thanks Mr Tim, Really learning alot from you guys here.

My local Wheelbuilder recommended me to go with Kinlin Xr300 with Tune hubs. Tune Mag 170 and Mig 70.

I am just looking to see if there are better alternates to build a similar set as the one above. Because i basically test rode the wheelset and liked it.

Frankly im more for weight and durability of the wheelset. Durability being the more important of the two.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:07 am 
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Thanks guys for the info, deeply appreciated.

I think i am going for the Kinlin XR300 with Alchemy hubs 18/20 with Sapim CX ray spokes.

Any last advise would be appreciated too :D


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 3:38 am 
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Location: Center of the Universe
The xr300 are very nice rims. I have 2 sets of them and one set of the 27's.
18/20 spokes might be a little on the light side for your weight, which is the same as me.
Consider the 27s for the 25g per wheel of weight savings or maybe a 30 rear and 27 up front. Which is what I have been riding lately.

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TIME RXR


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 8:31 am 
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Location: Melbourne, Australia
If you want a bit more durability go 24 rear. They will ride better and need less maintenance. Alchemy hubs are very stiff and wide but you still need enough spokes to support the wheel. Also if you want to go 18 front stick to the XR300s for a bit of extra rim stiffness.

Since you are riding mostly flat roads I'm assuming there aren't as many high speed (40kph) or tight cornering involved. The Kinlins will do fine for this with nice tires 21-23mm wide. I've been running the XR300 for a few years and found the braking did start to pulse a bit, and my next wheels will have a wider rim to support the tire side walls better cornering under my not so weight weenie mass.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 3:49 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2009 7:13 pm
Posts: 83
As others have suggested you should consider the wider rims available HED C2, Velocity A23, HP Archetype. I just built a set of HED C2 clinchers with DT Swiss 190/240s hubs and CX-Xrays and those rims are really well built. I have no experience with the hubs you mention but I can tell you that after using DT Swiss hubs for years on 3 bikes (mtn and road) that they are very solid and when I have had an issue (chipped 36 pt star ratchet) DT has responded promptly and resolved it with no cost to me. They stand behind their product. The star ratchet can be lubed without any specialized tools and this is the only maintenance required until a bearing goes or you get water in the hub.

These components are not the lightest but they are very reliable and have large enough companies standing behind them to service/warranty them.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 4:48 pm 
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Thanks for all the suggestions guys! :D Ill take into consideration the spokes..:P Perhaps i should go for 24 for the rear and 20 front ya? Im not going for record breaking timing anyway. Just want a nice custom wheel to ride with.

I have also been reading up on the Soul Wheels ... S3.0 SL and the S4.0 ... for the price i heard its a good wheelset to have. Many good reviews so far. Anyway thoughts on this wheelset?


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Posted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 4:48 pm 


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 5:42 pm 
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I'm building a set with the XR380's in 20/24 with CX Rays. I live in a mostly flat area and could use the aero and also the fact that they are such a stiff rim. Should get my moneys worth out of them. I'm using the Token carbon hubs with the Tiramec bearings.


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