"PRO" Cycling Discussion

Questions about bike hire abroad and everything light bike related. No off-topic chat please

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Anders3404
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Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:50 am

by Anders3404

Saxo Bank to hold pressconference on thursday in Madrid. http://teamsaxotinkoff.com/ny_news.asp? ... 25&lang=uk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; about the future of the team

Speculations are new bike sponsor, a merger between Euskatel and Saxo, perhaps Fernando Alonso will bring Banco Santander onboard

petepeterson
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by petepeterson

Ideas for developing pro cycling as a brand really interest me. Talking about revenue sharing is good but much work is needed first to create something that commands lots of $ for broadcast rights.

Here are some questions and ideas.

1) Broadcasting Rights
Is there anyone here who can actually quantify what TV revenue world/pro/grand tour races other than the Tour actually generate? I ask because from the north american perspective it sure doesn't look like much beyond the Tour. Other than that most of the races here in Canada are broadcast by Universal Sports with Schlanger and Gogulski in their mom's basement.... Il Lombardia was broadcast on Monday morning here in Canada.... I am all for it but I think you need to ask the question of what do networks actually pay the race organizers?

2) PED use
What would happen to viewership and broadcast value and fan support for cycling if it treated PED use with a more 'PR focused' approach like the other sports. Football (american included) Tennis, Baseball, Hockey, (basically all professional sports) to cycling. I was watching (american) football on the weekend and the announcers mentioned how a player 'missed' a game or two due to 'violating the league substance abuse policy' or something like that. The commentator mentioned it casually like it was an injury. The league clearly manages the information and how the media reports it. I don't think it's ethically correct - but can cycling learn from it beyond T&R??

3)Teams
Is there a better way to structure teams from the current model where all you need is a rich owner/sponsor with a lot of money to buy riders with UCI points and not necessarily any long term ambitions. Is there a way to create incentive for national federations, cities, regions to field teams that would appeal to a broader market than just cycling fans? Should the UCI market the sport in this way? Should the responsibility be shouldered by the UCI to manage a top flight 'league' and attract credible owners.

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SalsaLover
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by SalsaLover

That one was one if the longest posts I've seen ever on my tapatalk.

I bet it was interesting, I marked it on my favorites bar... Someday when I have the time I will come back here and read it.

I promise it will be before 2020 :thumbsup:
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prendrefeu
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by prendrefeu

Sorry about that. :(
I'm really passionate about solving these sort of issues (marketing, growth, and societal) but the tend to be very complex and solutions often come from tangential issues which affect the larger, hollistic goal... and then that means having to write it all out in order to explain how things are inter-connected. Putting it into a 'tldr' style post would miss the logic and reasoning completely. I'm sorry about that. :(
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Kjetil
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by Kjetil

That was a good read, prend. Thanks.
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tymon_tm
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by tymon_tm

few suggestions:

the highest number of viewers are gathered by the events that are broadcasted live in the evenings - Super Bowl, Champions League, Football WC, athletics finals (Golden League), Grand Slam... it's not about the discipline here as much as about the hours

cycling races are... long. most races/stages are simply boring (for the majority of potential viewers) till the very finish. cycling's not very TV friendly as it lacks spectacularity. just like biathlon or marathons. you won't understand the importance and difficulty of what's going on unless you try doing it on your own. that can be at least partially coped with by transmitting only the final parts of the race, but someone might ask: why the hell do they race a 200+km circuit if only last 20 are being shown? what's happening there and why? what's the purpose?

PR and public perception are a nightmare. even if you manage to bring some more excitement to a rather dull spectacle (like banning the radios, introducing smaller teams and perhaps more crit-like racing), the ongoing doping drama will still remain repeling for the vast majority of potential sponsors and viewers. let's face it - even the most gifted manager won't squeeze anything from cycling as it is now. if pro cycling is to expand, we gotta quit this 'clean sport' nonsense, as other disciplines clearly have. instead of diminishing guys like Armstrong or Ullrich, who made some of the best spectacles cycling's ever seen, use them and their names to attract people (who mostly either don't give a damn about hematocrit levels (what?) and homogeneus blood transfusions (WHAT?), or never really heard/understood what's the whole fuss about)
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MarkTwain
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by MarkTwain

prendrefeu wrote:@DJM

...

Apologies KWalker, that was a long post


Not the only one.

Image

Herb5998
Posts: 327
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2009 12:24 am

by Herb5998

@petepeterson

Excellent point on #2 WRT the way certain leagues handle PED Use. Yes, I don't agree with the way NFL, MLB, NBA, etc deal with PED use and how they basically use their PR Machine to control the perception of the use. One thing that allows them to do that though is the Collective Bargaining Agreements between the leagues and the athletes. While MLB and NFL use aspects of it to control the perception of PED use/testing/enforcement, the CBAs also provide more protections to the players (minimum salaries, privacy concerns WRT contracts and PED testing, transfer rules). Yes it's good that the UCI do a press release when someone tests positive, but how many times in recent years has that information been leaked by people charged with protecting the privacy of the athletes? I'm not saying cyclists should be allowed to go back to the bad old/recent times, but some privacy must be respected.

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stella-azzurra
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by stella-azzurra

Horner's twitter rant for winning a GT but not finding a team for next year.

9.37pm Pacific Daylight Time: 15 years old and up @ 4:30am before school starts to train while dreaming of winning a grand tour. I did that!

9.44pm PDT Riding your bike to work so that you can train for hours in the dark after works done. I did that!

9.53pm PDT Hitching a ride across the country for months w/no money (almost I had 400+-) to race. I did that!

9.58pm PDT Sleeping in hotels,host family houses,cars,and park benches to get to the races. I did that!

10.02pm PDT Pro teams won't give you chance, so you buy your own license and race as an independent. I did that!

10.09pm PDT Race pro for years w/out pay just hoping to make enough winnings to pay rent. I did that!

10.17pm PDT Win everything in the US, pass on the big pay check, go to Europe for minimum pay. #ididthat!

10.27pm PDT Live in Europe in a small apartment W/no car,computer,phone,TV, only a walk for company. #ididthat!

10.28pm PDT Oops. Only a Walkman for company. #ididthat!

10.33pm PDT Take a step back hoping to go forward again. #ididthat!

10.39pm PDT Winning again but told I'm to old to go back to Europe a second time but keep fighting anyways. #ididthat!

10.45pm PDT Sell everything I own for a second chance at a grand tour, fly over with a 140bucks in my pocket. #ididthat!

10.54pm PDT Start going up the ladder with each year passing while never getting that leader respect and belief. #ididthat!

11.00pm PDT Up @6am w/3kids so I can drop them off @school before I go train all day for the Grand tours. #ididthat!

11.03pm PDT Finding that belief, given the leadership, delivering on it. #ididthat!

11.13pm PDT Moving up the ladder w/that continued belief, big sponsors on board now. #ididthat!

11.18pm PDT Whole season disappearing fast but still working hard to make it to those grand tours. #ididthat!

11.21pm PDT Amazing help and belief from all my family, friends, and fans to get back there. #ididthat!

11.32pm PDT Works paid off, forms back, but by now some have lost belief. #ididthat!

11.40pm PDT So much stress & work 4another start at a dream that began many years ago. #ididthat!

11.43pm PDT A life time of work and a stage/jersey arrive and disappear over night.
#ididthat!

11.51pm PDT 100% is given and second time it happens, only to pass just as fast but
belief is returning. #ididthat!

12.04am PDT The jersey returned only this time for life, the stories to tell before & during it are epic & life time. #ididthat

12.08am PDT Yes it was worth it and yes the dream continues... With or without the belief. #ididthat!
I never took drugs to improve my performance at any time. I will be willing to stick my finger into a polygraph test if anyone with big media pull wants to take issue. If you buy a signed poster now it will not be tarnished later. --Graeme Obree

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53x12
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by 53x12

MarkTwain wrote:
prendrefeu wrote:@DJM

...

Apologies KWalker, that was a long post


Not the only one.




Hahaha, word.
"Marginal gains are the only gains when all that's left to gain is in the margins."

petepeterson
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by petepeterson

prendrefeu wrote:Sorry about that.


Don't apologize. If people want to skip over posts they can do that. It's disappointing to see people mocking a long post. What makes WW great is that in addition to forum banter and trolling it has has informed thoughtful posting by a lot of really smart people. I thought more people would care about this stuff but I guess it's not everyone's cup o tea.

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djm
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by djm

@prendrefeu Thanks for the insight and I largely agree with you. The coming years will be exciting. How many rich uncles are there? Quite few. Cycling needs to look elsewhere for more sponsorship. As of now the PED issue is the biggest single inhibiting factor for economic success. As petepeterson points out cycling may have some PR work to do. Surely the sport has been ravaged by PED abuse, but however unbelievable it might be it appears cycling is doing much more than other sports to prevent it. In spite of it the other sports are unaffected by all the positives and the organized doping going on (like in football, American football, track and field etc. etc.), while cycling is suffering.

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tymon_tm
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by tymon_tm

crazy stuff's been going on recently..

Horner, like/believe him or not, has just won the Vuelta in a great fashion. he's currently unemployed.

Luis Leon's no slouch either, but he's just been fired on some doping-related insinuations by the very same people who apparently run a very successfull doping programm for years.

how on earth proi cycling can move on, or progress in any way, if it's cutting the very branches it sits on :noidea:
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djm
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by djm

I'd be quite reluctant to hire a guy like Horner if I were in charge of a team, in spite of him winning the tour of Spain. Seemingly it is not a problem for him to find an employer, as he points out in a recent Velonews interview, the problem is finding one that will meet his demands. Apparently he would like to be paid very well and wants a sign-on-fee and the ability to stay in the US with his family.

What happens if he suffers an injury that any 25-year old would recover from but might be troublesome for a 42-year old? Also he's pretty much overdue for retirement any way. There's a fairly big risk with employing him and most likely Horner will have to adjust his demands unless there is a team that really needs him and his points. It seems like the hunt for points this year is far less aggressive than it has been in the past.

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petepeterson
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by petepeterson

And today another fine example of the sport ruining itself in attempt at survival:
Belkin pleads ignorance to knowledge of the former Liberty Seguros rider even though his links to Fuentes and Schumi were published while they reaped the benefits his wins at the Tour, San Sebastian. Now they throw him under the bus stating "His name is reported in too many cases" in an attempt to establish credibility. The UCI needs to get ahold of how this stuff is dealt with. It's just so amateur.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/belkin-buy-luis-leon-sanchez-out-of-his-contract

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