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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 9:44 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 12:06 am
Posts: 1246
Location: A Scotsman on rock in the pacific
So.. here's some background info. About 2 months ago I sold some derailleur parts to a WW user in Spain "DeiviX"... So far, the parts haven't arrived. Since then all I've had is constant combardment over WW PM system about wanting his money back (we're talking <$40 here) and how I've supposedly deceived this guy (And yeah, I have ebay feedback of 161 @ 100% positive with many sales into $1000's as well as many successful sales through this forum)... so yeah, I want to cheat someone out of $40. Right....! So, in this situation, what do you do? "DeiviX" is out some cash, and I'm out most of a rear derailleur. Right now we're both losing... I don't have the mailing reciept, only a the charge on my credit card statement from USPS when I told him I'd mailed the items. I've also filed a lost / rifled mail report with USPS. What else can I do? Usuaully when someone doesn't make it to the reciepent, USPS return it to the senders address. So far I've not received it so can only assume that "DeiviX" has...

Would be nice to hear the thoughts of others that sell on here...

Merry Christmas 8)

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Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 9:44 pm 


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 11:54 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 18, 2005 6:24 pm
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Location: BELGIUM
There is really not much you can do. The only way to ensure a package arrives is to use insured shipping. This way the package is traced by barcode at every step. If something goes wrong, the shipping can be traced and you can get your money back. I assume you sent it by regular mail ?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 1:04 am 
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I lost $400 sending Toko in Brasil some parts. We had worked together before and after so I just wound up eating it. BTW, it didn't taste very good. :cry:

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 5:26 am 
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Location: Lyon, France
mzagorski wrote:
Usuaully when someone doesn't make it to the reciepent, USPS return it to the senders address. So far I've not received it so can only assume that "DeiviX" has...


I've had senders in the US mistakenly ship via surface mail to Australia... and the parts turned up after 4 months. Other parts simply never arrived. Maybe they were never posted, I can't be sure. I'd rate USPS international surface mail as one of the worst mail services anywhere.

Basically you should have some agreement about who carries the risk for anything sent without tracking. When the shipper made the mistake, I asked for my money back (and got it... then in one case sent it back again...:lol: ).
Where I asked for surface (a heavy motorcycle wheel), I ate it.

Unless the item is heavy, ALWAYS use EMS.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 5:52 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 12:06 am
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Location: A Scotsman on rock in the pacific
I'd sent is USPS int'l.. .7-10 days option... first time anything I've sent hasn't arrived. also, no way to track an int'l shipment with usps, right? iirc, it's only trackable until it leave the US... The item I sent was going to Spain... I can see it still turning up, but the buyer is far from happy... and lost patience long ago :?

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 5:53 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 4:39 am
Posts: 1688
Location: Los Angeles=Hills, Smog
I love going into the USPS office just to watch how slow someone can complete a task. I was just the yesterday & couldn't believe it took the teller ate least 30 seconds to grab a paperclip from the tray 1/2 an arms length away & put it over to pieces of paper. i kid you not, it was just like watching it in slow motion. She "Very" slowly moved her arm to the tray & back & placed the clip over the papers so slowly that i almost fell asleep watching it. It's a wonder they get anything done at all...I've had my mailman pick up my Mortgage paymet from my mailbox & drop it off 2 doors down. I drop it at a box now.. I've lost numerous items in the mail, but what can you do? The price can be so tempting, especially out of country.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 9:43 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 12:06 am
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Location: A Scotsman on rock in the pacific
I'm not surprised at the constant postage increases at USPS... As Hype points out, they are as slow as sloths. Some of them are on it, but most take F O R E V E R... and the lines are ridiculously long.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:04 am 
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Location: BELGIUM
When i receive packages from the US, I can trace them from the belgian post website.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:20 pm 
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They make me wanna go postal.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:24 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 11:44 am
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I guess there's pretty much nothing you can do. I had the same, A shim was sent from the USA to me (Holland) the package arrived just as planed but the box was empty. The seller was sure he put the part in, but it wasn't there. Now we came out right because the seller offered to sent a new one but it could have turned out way differently. In that case it's just your word against his/her so there's nothing you can do.

If you have a Note or tracking number you can go the the post office but I don't know how that will end up.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:42 pm 
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I believe you did nothing wrong. Maybe wait a short while and agree to split the difference with the guy. Since it is only $40 (luckily) agree to send him $20 plus half the shipping. That way neither of you is really out anything. If he doesn't agree to that just move on.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 5:26 pm 
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Location: Sydney
I've had this happen to me on ebay and missed out on the 'paypal' protection period. I thought it was fair that the seller and I split the loss, which was around US$100 for a crankset that never arrived (and still hasn't). Instead of taking cash though, I bought some more things off him and sent him some more cash for the difference. Think the key in this case was he thought he had insured it.

USPS don't respond to the lost mail reports, they really are useless in responding to issues with their tracked mail packages (this one never left the US according to their tracker) and has made me very wary of buying anything from the US and USPS. Even the follow package took twice as long as it should've.

Although for $40, I wouldn't be expecting anything from the seller. Not if I opted out of taking insurance.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:22 pm 
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Location: Hamilton, Canada
US Postal needs to get back into doping.

Although on eBay, this 'lost package' is a retailer's tool. Sometimes they don't get enough on an auction, so they say it got lost in the mail and refund the buyer. You can tell because they refund immediately.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:21 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 7:16 am
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Location: Lyon, France
mzagorski wrote:
also, no way to track an int'l shipment with usps, right?


Supposedly includes a delivery guarantee:

http://www.usps.com/international/expre ... tional.htm

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:17 am 
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Location: Hollywood
I'm in the same boat, MikeZ. Campy derailleur going to Italy. Been 3 weeks, still isn't there. In 400+ ebay transactions, I've never had a package get lost...so i'm still holding out hope. The buyer placed a hold on my paypal account, which is pretty frustrating...that aside, he's been cool about it.

On another note: usps postal insurance is terrible. So many hoops have to be jumped through to get any compensation. I've stopped buying insurance for this reason. My bad experience with insurance was 2 years ago. Doubt it's changed since then.

With all this said...what's to stop a jerk from getting an un-tracked package then saying he never got it and waiting for full or partial compensation? Just one of those catch-22s that come with the internet game...

the dude abides

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Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:17 am 


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