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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:50 pm 
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It sounds like he wants to come to the us for the experience and cycling/racing just happens to be the hobby he wants to maintain.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:44 pm 
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Gunna be sorely disappointed with almost the entire U.S. race scene. Having pulled data from Road Results there is not a single area in the country that has not suffered a fairly hefty decline in number of races and number of participants in said races. I honestly don't see how the sport can survive with it's current model and cost structure.

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Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:44 pm 


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:59 pm 
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KWalker wrote:
I honestly don't see how the sport can survive with it's current model and cost structure.


+1. You hit the nail on the head with this statement.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 2:40 am 
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+1


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 3:21 am 
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Sounds like Cycling Australia....

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 3:37 am 
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Location: Blacksburg, VA
USA Cycling just sent out an email to people on various collegiate conference list serves.

Licenses are down 20%, across all conferences, from 2011.

That's crazy.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:57 am 
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Posts: 554
Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Perhaps this is compensated by an increase of a 'non-race' Gran Fondo events?

Edit: I dont know if there is even an increase of Gran Fondos in the US.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:02 pm 
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Location: Bay Area
I've been working on a meta-analysis for a freelance article. 20% is super good compared to some regions of the country, where we are talking year-over-year decreases in the order of 40%/year or in some cases 80% net in a 5 year period. I've also surveyed hundreds of riders and waiting for more respondents so I can get a decent cohort of both active and inactive riders, but so far most people feel that the category system makes racing pointless, self involved, and doesn't promote actual in race dynamics. The majority also feel that calendars are oversaturated with races that are too similar and that over time the challenge of racing becomes redundant.

Fondos are pretty damn expensive too. I think my Belgian Waffle Ride entry was $125 or $150. Pretty sweet course, but let's be real I could just ride it on the weekend with friends if I wanted to.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:23 pm 
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Location: Blacksburg, VA
KWalker wrote:
I've been working on a meta-analysis for a freelance article. 20% is super good compared to some regions of the country, where we are talking year-over-year decreases in the order of 40%/year or in some cases 80% net in a 5 year period. I've also surveyed hundreds of riders and waiting for more respondents so I can get a decent cohort of both active and inactive riders, but so far most people feel that the category system makes racing pointless, self involved, and doesn't promote actual in race dynamics. The majority also feel that calendars are oversaturated with races that are too similar and that over time the challenge of racing becomes redundant.

Fondos are pretty damn expensive too. I think my Belgian Waffle Ride entry was $125 or $150. Pretty sweet course, but let's be real I could just ride it on the weekend with friends if I wanted to.


One of the problems here in VA is that the race organizers can't seem to avoid conflicts with each other.

I won't speak for 2017, but in years past, there were multiple weekends with two or three races within a few hours of here (Blacksburg, VA), and then nothing for a few weeks. While I realize that there are forces I may not know about that govern when promoters decide to put on races, if they have competition for a race weekend, they aren't going to get as many participants as they might have wanted.

Given that we are in an era where it's relatively easy to put an event on a calendar of otherwise non-affiliated events, observe the scheduled dates for other events, and resolve conflicts before they arise, it seems like organizers are either ignorant or stubborn. Neither of which is a recipe for success, in my opinion.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:36 pm 
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The same shit happens regularly here in Australia. Perfect example was the Tour of Bright and the LeTap, $200 for a day with Froomey and 2000 other muppets or $120 for 3 days of stage racing on the same weekend?... Not hard to decide. Undoubtedly tho both lost $ due to scheduling.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:44 pm 
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Is this the post Lance affect in the US? Cycling boomed after Lemond started winning in Europe and then it waned. Cycling boomed again during Lance's reign and now it's back down.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:12 pm 
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Location: Bay Area
LeDuke wrote:
KWalker wrote:
I've been working on a meta-analysis for a freelance article. 20% is super good compared to some regions of the country, where we are talking year-over-year decreases in the order of 40%/year or in some cases 80% net in a 5 year period. I've also surveyed hundreds of riders and waiting for more respondents so I can get a decent cohort of both active and inactive riders, but so far most people feel that the category system makes racing pointless, self involved, and doesn't promote actual in race dynamics. The majority also feel that calendars are oversaturated with races that are too similar and that over time the challenge of racing becomes redundant.

Fondos are pretty damn expensive too. I think my Belgian Waffle Ride entry was $125 or $150. Pretty sweet course, but let's be real I could just ride it on the weekend with friends if I wanted to.


One of the problems here in VA is that the race organizers can't seem to avoid conflicts with each other.

I won't speak for 2017, but in years past, there were multiple weekends with two or three races within a few hours of here (Blacksburg, VA), and then nothing for a few weeks. While I realize that there are forces I may not know about that govern when promoters decide to put on races, if they have competition for a race weekend, they aren't going to get as many participants as they might have wanted.

Given that we are in an era where it's relatively easy to put an event on a calendar of otherwise non-affiliated events, observe the scheduled dates for other events, and resolve conflicts before they arise, it seems like organizers are either ignorant or stubborn. Neither of which is a recipe for success, in my opinion.


It's the same in CA. There are a few big for-profit promoters and almost every weekend has multiple conflicting events. Red Kite basically runs the same series of office park crits, circuit races and a few TTs every year. They get pretty solid attendance since they used to have a cheap 2nd race feature so you could race 2 races in a day in a short drive/train ride/ride from home as opposed to driving far away. But what if you don't like crits that much?

Well VeloPromo puts on a ton of races, a redundant amount. Lots of the courses use parts of each other. Some of their coolest races were gone for overlap, distance, or logistic reasons. So, most of the races are basically just reallllllly long crits. Not only is there schedule conflicts, it's like requiring one to choose between the 60min 4 corner crit, or the longer crit that has a few small hills or shitty pave-ment.

Tons of redundancy and for what reward? What does being a cat 1 mean vs. being a 3? Lots of cat 1s aren't any faster. Some are just good at always being 4th in a sprint. Even then they get bored of the repetition and often the lack of teamwork that is honestly required. Then they do a race with real pros and get shit on. Meanwhile they sacrifice lots of their life for what? What's the end? There has to be variation and excitement.

I don't think it's post-Lance at all. If anything the boom from 2009-2013/14 I'd say largely came from better organization and, in a way, things like message boards and social media. I started riding because of a local fixed gear forum where we organized group rides and later all transitioned into road racing from alleycats. It also became easier to find the local group ride or link up with people that rode than before.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:03 am 
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Red Kite attendance seems to be dropping this year. Might be related to fewer racers staying in the sport or it may be that the price increases every year. $60 for two crits 60 min crits on the same square is a tough sell. He's kept people engaged by having everything count toward some year end omnium (not sure what the winner's take is on that, hopefully more than the wine). I've been skipping them because I don't like racing at 3PM and 5PM on Sunday in Livermore.

I'd like to see NCNCA develop a "Classic Criterium" series that leads to increased attendance at the more unique events. Include the Giro, Oakland Grand Prix, Vacaville, Lodi, etc. Those bring in a bit more public interest than blocking the hockey families trying to get to the rink in Livermore.

Velo Promo has some interesting events, but most are suffering by being way the heck out in the middle of nowhere. I sense that a lot of racers would rather hit Spectrum or similar and be home before noon than wake up at 3 to drive to the foothills, race, and get home at dark.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 8:14 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:42 pm
Posts: 863
Location: Pa USA
Boomers ageing out, next generations less likely to ride due to the hazards perceived on the roads with distracted drivers et al. And all of the above re pricing and overlap.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 9:34 pm 
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Location: Bay Area
A friend won the omnium and I think got a Garmin Edge and a gift certificate to a shop. And tons and tons of shitty wine.

CA is kinda screwed on road races and driving since the choices are either the Central Valley or surrounding hills. Berkeley Hills RR is a rare example of a race within city limits that isn't super far. But even if every race was like that, why would people pay to do a race in Petaluma when Roasters is free. And forget anyone ever getting permits to shut down coastal or tourist roads (barring fondos).

You hit the last nail on the head for road racing. It's almost as if people just want to race so they can siq brag on the group rides about their category number or watts.

After a while there needs to be variation and change. Back East in MABRA there is slightly lower attendance, but between when I started riding now lots of events have come, gone, and changed. Enough to keep it interesting. And with mid-week racing and so much group riding there is a big sense of community with few races that are all that far.

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Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 9:34 pm 


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