2017 'PRO' cycling discussion.
Moderators: robbosmans, Moderator Team
Lots of things happened I think. Bit of a round up from interviews on Sporza:
Sagan said that he didn't understand Terpstra and that Terpstra isn't his teammate so why should he ride for him (blaming Terpstra for not joining the effort).
Apparently Quickstep asked Terpstra to take it a bit slower on turns so that the team could put some pressure on them with Boonen and Gaviria behind and give him reason to take half pulls.
Terpstra on his turn was angry at Soren Kragh for not joining in on efforts. He even said something like "but that's typical for that team". Bit below the belt if you ask me. He also said it was up to Sagan as World champion to close the gap since he had Gaviria and Boonen behind him.
Sagan played poker and he lost. It was his race to win as fastest sprinter. Why should Terpstra ride if he's the slowest of them all in a sprint? Even Stannard has outsprinted him in Omloop. I think they all played a game. Maybe Soren Kragh really was empty, but Sagan probably wanted to send a message a week before RVV. And it's safe to say Terpstra won't get any room to attack if it's up to Sagan.
Sagan said that he didn't understand Terpstra and that Terpstra isn't his teammate so why should he ride for him (blaming Terpstra for not joining the effort).
Apparently Quickstep asked Terpstra to take it a bit slower on turns so that the team could put some pressure on them with Boonen and Gaviria behind and give him reason to take half pulls.
Terpstra on his turn was angry at Soren Kragh for not joining in on efforts. He even said something like "but that's typical for that team". Bit below the belt if you ask me. He also said it was up to Sagan as World champion to close the gap since he had Gaviria and Boonen behind him.
Sagan played poker and he lost. It was his race to win as fastest sprinter. Why should Terpstra ride if he's the slowest of them all in a sprint? Even Stannard has outsprinted him in Omloop. I think they all played a game. Maybe Soren Kragh really was empty, but Sagan probably wanted to send a message a week before RVV. And it's safe to say Terpstra won't get any room to attack if it's up to Sagan.
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Calling out GvA for passive riding or even wheelsucking is totally off. My impression is, he knows his capabilities like no other rider and always made the best out of it. He did not have the tactics and knew his physical limits and then second was best he was able to do (which is already amazing considering who he lost out to). Now he is just on another level and still times it perfectly. His moves today, pure class, unmatched atm.
Well Søren Kragh Andersen had his captain behind him wanting the final to be a sprint, so I think he was told not to work all that hard. Søren Kragh told some danish journalist that Terpstra spat him in the face during the final kilometers. I dont see Terpstra as a very likable guy.
http://ekstrabladet.dk/sport/cykling/dansker-ydmyget-i-stjernestund-spyttet-i-ansigtet/6590271
http://ekstrabladet.dk/sport/cykling/dansker-ydmyget-i-stjernestund-spyttet-i-ansigtet/6590271
once GVA and Keuke rode off, it was apparent the remaining trio won't work well - and they haven't. I understand the notion was that if they do bridge the gap, Sagan's got the win in his pocket. but - god damn it - racing is about taking chances, and letting go and not doing pulls because there's a (potentially) stronger rider is just plain dumb, especially if you still have like 10 kilometers to go. I think Terpstra in particular lost some fans today.
kkibbler wrote: WW remembers.
I think Sagan has been pushed up against the wall, left with no choice. Last weekend he did all the work, and got outsprinted by fresher legs (Kwiato). This weekend he wanted to get to the finish without doing all the work. But nobody really wanted him to get there. I think it's true like he said in the post race interview; Terpstra would rather see Sagan fail than chasing his own victory with the risk of failure. Poor sportsmanship.
Regarding Soren Kragh, he is a sprinter himself. I'm pretty sure he didn't have the legs to chase, otherwise he would have done so and joined the sprint in the finale.
Quickstep are (again) the big losers of the day imo.
Regarding Soren Kragh, he is a sprinter himself. I'm pretty sure he didn't have the legs to chase, otherwise he would have done so and joined the sprint in the finale.
Quickstep are (again) the big losers of the day imo.
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It sure seems like lots of posters here have never raced. Nothing wrong with that of course but perhaps a good reason to refrain from commenting on tactics. There was nothing wrong with Terpstra's riding today. The butt pincher can cry all he wants. His road to victory, like Cancellara's before him, is going to be tougher and tougher each year because he's the most marked man in the peloton in the races he can win. None of you commenting on Terpstra have raced if you think a lesser sprinter is going to work to bring a guy, who will cetainly beat him in a sprint, up to a breakaway.
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Colnago e Campagnolo
Vagabond wrote:It sure seems like lots of posters here have never raced. Nothing wrong with that of course but perhaps a good reason to refrain from commenting on tactics. There was nothing wrong with Terpstra's riding today. The butt pincher can cry all he wants. His road to victory, like Cancellara's before him, is going to be tougher and tougher each year because he's the most marked man in the peloton in the races he can win. None of you commenting on Terpstra have raced if you think a lesser sprinter is going to work to bring a guy, who will cetainly beat him in a sprint, up to a breakaway.
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Well, I'd question why he was even working at all then. Why would Terpstra take a single pull in the group of 5 or then the group of 3?
If he wanted to work for the sprint (Gaviria/Boonen) his tactics didn't make sense. If he wanted a shot at the win for himself, his tactics didn't make much sense either. Taking himself and two others off the back then not trying to jump back up to the lead group?
He doesn't give himself a chance to take a patented Terpatra flyer if he's 10s behind the lead group.
And yeah, been racing for over a decade.
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Last edited by LeDuke on Sun Mar 26, 2017 11:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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LeDuke wrote:Vagabond wrote:It sure seems like lots of posters here have never raced. Nothing wrong with that of course but perhaps a good reason to refrain from commenting on tactics. There was nothing wrong with Terpstra's riding today. The butt pincher can cry all he wants. His road to victory, like Cancellara's before him, is going to be tougher and tougher each year because he's the most marked man in the peloton in the races he can win. None of you commenting on Terpstra have raced if you think a lesser sprinter is going to work to bring a guy, who will cetainly beat him in a sprint, up to a breakaway.
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Well, I'd question why he was even working at all then. Why would Terpstra take a single pull in the group of 5 or then the group of 3?
If he wanted to work for the sprint (Gaviria/Boonen) his tactics didn't make sense. If he wanted a shot at the win for himself, his tactics didn't make much sense either. Taking himself and two others off the back then not trying to jump back up to the lead group?
He doesn't give himself a chance to take a patented Terpatra flyer if he's 10s behind the lead group.
And yeah, been racing for over a decade.
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Like I said my intention wasn't to offend anyone. With all of them together it made sense for him to do some work for an outside shot at a win or place. But once the other two went up the road he had to have been thinking there was no way it makes any sense to help Sagan and another faster sprinter bridge up. This kind of situation is why I maintain that victories for Sagan in the classics and even more sought after monuments will be rare. Next weekend is going to be very interesting. So far a good season of exciting racing.
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derpstra, why u do dat.
forreal he could have taken his chances for a rouleur
forreal he could have taken his chances for a rouleur
Did you actually watch what happened?boots2000 wrote:Seems to me that Sagan's tactic was to ride those two off the back and bridge crossed to those two alone.
It would have been tactical genius if it worked- Instead he came off looking foolish.
i imagined sagan's move was about clearly communicating that he won't be the mule. it was just what people said he should do after MSR, i.e. be prepared to lose if he wants to win.
still i thought he might have rued his decision later. it looked like at least GVA and that other dude were going to work with him to get to the line.
GVA is not my favourite rider for whatever reason but he was amazingly strong; first the attack, then alot of work in the group leading up to their being 5 and then some awesome work into the line as part of a group of 2. totally dominant. i was very surprised that in the last 10 or so km's he was out of his saddle really putting in to keep the gap to the sagan group. such stamina and strength.
still i thought he might have rued his decision later. it looked like at least GVA and that other dude were going to work with him to get to the line.
GVA is not my favourite rider for whatever reason but he was amazingly strong; first the attack, then alot of work in the group leading up to their being 5 and then some awesome work into the line as part of a group of 2. totally dominant. i was very surprised that in the last 10 or so km's he was out of his saddle really putting in to keep the gap to the sagan group. such stamina and strength.
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If Sagan had bridged i bet my house GVA and Jens would have let him work more. May be not as bad as Niki and Soren but you could be damn sure GVA wouldnt be seen in the front more than Sagan. The only reason Jens and GVA worked in tandam as they did because both were not the sprinter of Sagan's caliber and would be willing to take chance in a two man head to head sprint. GVA is no wheelsucker (in Omlool he also worked a lot but made sure it was less than Sagan's share).
I take nothing away from GVA's victory. He was the strongest by far with sharp instinct to dictate and follow moves. Always the only guy at the frontend when it matters and had the confidence to sprint in a leadout position.
Such is the fate of the world champ the only things he can do are 1. i lose you lose 2. Find the strength to leave everyone in the dust 3. Find stronger teammates (not likely, or else they would share the leader position) 4. Accept his fate and just try to win, just like Cancellara in his later years.
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I take nothing away from GVA's victory. He was the strongest by far with sharp instinct to dictate and follow moves. Always the only guy at the frontend when it matters and had the confidence to sprint in a leadout position.
Such is the fate of the world champ the only things he can do are 1. i lose you lose 2. Find the strength to leave everyone in the dust 3. Find stronger teammates (not likely, or else they would share the leader position) 4. Accept his fate and just try to win, just like Cancellara in his later years.
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