2016 'PRO' cycling discussion.

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Kermithimself
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by Kermithimself

The thing about Degenkolb is that he's a police officer - they're not exactly known to be hot heads. Must have been really annoyed by what happened for him to react that way.
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OJ
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Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 5:25 pm
Location: Winterpeg

by OJ

Has Degenkolb ever worked as a cop? Plus I know some cops who are like Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde on duty vs. off duty.
http://demarere.blogspot.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Multebear
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

liam7020 wrote:
Just seen this - fair play to Debusschere for keeping calm indeed.



The fact that he did, might confirm, that it was well deserved. Don't get me wrong, it's never ok to squirt water in someones face. But maybe Debusschere knew he had it coming. Let's all remember, we don't know exactly what happened before the incident, and there are always at least two sides to a story.

OJ wrote:
Plus I know some cops who are like Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde on duty vs. off duty.



Might I remind you, that cops are just normal people. Everyone can loose their temper cop or no cop.

Degenkolb seems to be a stand up guy. I wouldn't get surprised, if he offers a public apology at some point.
Last edited by Multebear on Thu Oct 20, 2016 10:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

Nefarious86
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by Nefarious86

Water I'd be ok with, a bottle full of Endura etc... I'd be pissed. His reaction to it was spot on tho, smile and wave boys.
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ghisallo2003
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Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:10 pm

by ghisallo2003

When I started racing 25 years ago, blocking was not in the playlist. If you had a team-mate in a break then you would sit on and take the free ride from the chasing group, but you did not see such a level of disruptive behaviour. Nor did you see a team sitting at the front of the peleton forming a wall to prevent organisation.

If you look at the women's racing you see very clear blocking activities, with riders moving out to stop each other. The UCI do need to clarify what is acceptable or the guys will indeed take things into their own hands to the detriment of the overall image of cycling.

Multebear
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by Multebear

ghisallo2003 wrote:When I started racing 25 years ago, blocking was not in the playlist. If you had a team-mate in a break then you would sit on and take the free ride from the chasing group, but you did not see such a level of disruptive behaviour. Nor did you see a team sitting at the front of the peleton forming a wall to prevent organisation.

If you look at the women's racing you see very clear blocking activities, with riders moving out to stop each other. The UCI do need to clarify what is acceptable or the guys will indeed take things into their own hands to the detriment of the overall image of cycling.


This is how racing is done these days. And I don't think there's anything to do about it. You don't own the road and thus can't decide who's allowed to sit where. The big problem with the WC race during the decisive split was, that only a few riders in group 2 really tried to chase and close the gap. The germans tried, but it seemed no one else wanted to help them. This is why it was so easy for the remaining two belgians to ruin it for the germans. If they'd had lets say 10-15 riders from different countries working together, they would just have waved the belgians away, and the belgians wouldn't have succeded disrupting the the work at the front. Or even better, they would have narrowed the echelon in the crosswinds and demoted the belgians out in the wind.

And this is the classic dilemma for the chasing group. If you can't work together in the chase, you'll never catch up. And if you're not enough guys working together at the front, you'll make it too easy for disruptive riders to break the chase. Same goes for the front group, if you can't work together, sooner or later you'll get caught. But if the break is caused by crosswinds, odds are always in favor of the front group. Because that's where the strongest riders are. If the strongest riders aren't at the front when the crosswinds hit, then the peloton wont break. These things are basics when riding with experienced racers. And this brings me back to the number one rule when riding crosswinds, be at the front, or get dropped. The belgians are some of the most experienced crosswind riders, and they just outsmarted the germans, the spanish and the rest. Plain and simple.
Last edited by Multebear on Thu Oct 20, 2016 10:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

KB
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Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2004 12:32 pm
Location: HULL UK

by KB

Agree with Multebear. It's no good whingeing like Degenkolb did; he should grow up. The Belgians did it perfectly and it's entirely reasonable to disrupt the chase and has been since I started following the sport (1960's); and happened before that.

If you don't get in the first echelon, then tough. You're not going to win.

nickl
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Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:37 am

by nickl

Multebear wrote:
ghisallo2003 wrote:When I started racing 25 years ago, blocking was not in the playlist. If you had a team-mate in a break then you would sit on and take the free ride from the chasing group, but you did not see such a level of disruptive behaviour. Nor did you see a team sitting at the front of the peleton forming a wall to prevent organisation.

If you look at the women's racing you see very clear blocking activities, with riders moving out to stop each other. The UCI do need to clarify what is acceptable or the guys will indeed take things into their own hands to the detriment of the overall image of cycling.


This is how racing is done these days. And I don't think there's anything to do about it. You don't own the road and thus can't decide who's allowed to sit where.


There's a big difference between the stuff that happened in the Women's Giro (last year?) where one team boxed a woman in and blocked her, vs in the Men's WC where a single cyclist kept getting in the paceline and not pulling through. That's been part of racing for as long as I've been following it - I remember discussions of it back in the Indurain days, and it wasn't exactly new then. Even in old books there is discussions of how to help a team mate by getting in a paceline and disrupting the chase.

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ave
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Location: Hungary

by ave

Regardin Juraj, recently I read it somewhere that when young, Peter was not too eager to go out to train, it was his brother who constantly pushed him, let's go, let's go.
So we must thank him! :)

Multebear
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by Multebear

nickl wrote:
There's a big difference between the stuff that happened in the Women's Giro (last year?) where one team boxed a woman in and blocked her, vs in the Men's WC where a single cyclist kept getting in the paceline and not pulling through.



Found some older footage. If this is the race you are referring to (haven't seen it before), then his is totally not ok and ought to be sanctioned somehow.

38:30 in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRskFaxzZiY

zirxo
Posts: 296
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by zirxo

That's not cool.

spud
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Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2009 5:52 am

by spud

extraordinary - if that happened in a men's race, there would be fisticuffs.

nathanong87
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by nathanong87

yea seen that old women's giro footage, idiotic.

i'm fine if teams on the front dont ride, but in my honest opinion you let other teams ride who want to ride. If noone wants to ride, then so be it. If someone wants to ride you let them take it up themselves, you dont ride in front of them intentionally and slam on the brakes. I've seen dudes sprint to the front of the pack in a finish just to slow pedal the front....

imho with amateur racing, teams shouldn't literally block the road intentionally line 5 across the road to slow things up. Let your boi attack and if u wanna chase down counters or whatever, so be it, but the 5 across the road yellow line rule is bleh.

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Multebear
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by Multebear

Degen-splash:
"he asked for a refreshment, and I just fulfilled his wish" :beerchug:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BLn-A2QBg7U/

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