New York Times on the "perils" of carbon fiber frames

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planB
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by planB

Interestingly, the journalist in question is an avid rider in my community. It reads like it was written by someone completely on the outside of the sport, but it's actually quite the opposite. To me, it seems like classic confirmation bias...

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Getter
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by Getter

Does the guy ride steel? :hmm: :mrgreen:

mattr
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by mattr

http://desperadocycles.com/Lowdown_On_Tubing.html
This popped up on retrobike a few days ago. Probably used the same source material.........

HillRPete
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by HillRPete

http://desperadocycles.com/Lowdown_On_Tubing.html wrote:Wood is a fiber reinforced with resin. No different is carbon fiber that is used in the cycling industry.

Oat with honey is fibre reinforced with resin. No different is carbon fibre that is used in the cycling industry.

Bogan
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by Bogan

I would be surprised if these articles influence anybodies decision on what to ride.
MAMIL? Never. O.F.I.L. yeh! (Old F**ker in Lycra)

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Stolichnaya
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by Stolichnaya

I am alarmed that anyone is actually still reading the NYT.
"All the news that's fit to print"... is not coming from that news crew. And has not been for quite some time.

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CBJ
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by CBJ

planB wrote:Interestingly, the journalist in question is an avid rider in my community. It reads like it was written by someone completely on the outside of the sport, but it's actually quite the opposite. To me, it seems like classic confirmation bias...


It seems that being an avid rider does not necessarily make you a carbon expert.

buttrumpus
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by buttrumpus

It seems like a lot of y'all are preying on the use of the word "explode" while the professor, a man who has studied the subject extensively, is pretty obviously making the point that failure with carbon is, for the most part, totally catastrophic, which is something you all know. I don't think there's anything terribly untrue with that article at all. Yes, bike companies are pulling one over on customers who are buying high-end carbon with the expectation it will be a life-time bike that will retain value. They're plastic and come popped out of a mold. And, buying a carbon race bike for day to day training is pretty silly in that in provides no real benefit, but there's nothing wrong with it if that's your thing. The author isn't saying everyone on this forum is wrong for the way they like to spend their money, he's just pointing out what everyone knows but no one likes to think about. We all die, all bikes die, girls poop. You know, that kind of stuff.

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kbbpll
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by kbbpll

The article pointedly says that the assistant professor has "studied injuries to 3,500 competitive cyclists", and then there's nothing regarding how many were because the bike "completely exploded". I ride steel, but I thought the article was pretty unfair.

Franklin
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by Franklin

buttrumpus wrote:It seems like a lot of y'all are preying on the use of the word "explode" while the professor, a man who has studied the subject extensively, is pretty obviously making the point that failure with carbon is, for the most part, totally catastrophic, which is something you all know.
Oh? Really? Say more catastrophic than sheared of Alu? Becuase contrary to what the article claims, when Alu goes it goes...

I don't think there's anything terribly untrue with that article at all.

Carbon-fiber frames and wheels tend to break
The bikes, they completely explode

Yeah, no problems with the message at all. Why, this is really really true. :noidea:

davidalone
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by davidalone

It's a stupid article. you'd think they'd get engineers to chime in - rather than people who don't know shit?

Any material can fail by catastrophic failure. Carbon can. Alu can. so can steel. it all depends on the strength of impact and any defects in the material. Any material can also fail by fatigue- just a matter of which material fatigues faster ( i.e. resistant to crack growth). and what the critical crack size is. Once you reach the critical crack size, your material fails FAST. doesn't matter if it's alumnium or CF or steel or titanium.

CF properties in tension are far better than any metal sued in bike building. problem is, CF is unpredictable because it is anisotropic. it doesn't do so well in shear or compression. so a fairly innocous knock in the wrong direction could have bad consequences. but- this is rare. any impact likely to shatter a CF frame is almost certainly going to damage any alu/steel/titanium frame beyond repair as well.

where carbon gets a bad rep is if you don't mantain or check your bike at all- carbon resists crack growth much less well than metals, so carbon needs to be inspected periodically. anyone who says carbon explodes has a thing or two coming- I have seen riders ride ( and win) amateur races on broken chainstays, handlebars, and stems. I've ridden a cracked carbon seatpost for years before replacing it.

Marin
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by Marin

Everyone believing that carbon is dangerous needs to watch this Santa Cruz carbon frame test, it's really amazing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xreZdUBqpJs

Franklin
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by Franklin

davidalone wrote: carbon resists crack growth much less well than metals, so carbon needs to be inspected periodically.

I'm sure you are right, but almost every catastrophic failure I have seen were either steel pedal spindles, Alu seatpost top, Alu crank, an Alu forktube or an Alu handlebar. And I'm sure those were generally cracks propagating, not pristine parts failing out of the blue. I'm sure the latter happens, but it's undoubtingly extremely rare. Especially Alu (used to be)is known to crack rapidly after a tiny damaged spot (engraving!).

I have seen plenty of total loss frames after a crash*, but I have never seen a catastrophic frame failure causing a crash in 30 years of racing. I'd say that a frame is not the most stressed component compared to the usual suspects (bar, pedal, forktube).

* My beautiful steel racer was wrecked by my wife who bumped a parked car with 5kmph when she couldn't clip in. When we came home we saw that the downtube developed a crack. Repairing the frame was economically nonsensical. High end steel is vulnerable to dents and cracks quite easily after a crash.

Vagabond
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by Vagabond

buttrumpus wrote:And, buying a carbon race bike for day to day training is pretty silly in that in provides no real benefit, but there's nothing wrong with it if that's your thing.


I don't think it's silly. I've ridden a great many steel frames, a couple of titanium, and several carbon fiber ones. I'll pick my carbon Colnagos over steel and titanium every time. The ride is so much nicer and hence more fun. And that's the real benefit to this former racer and lifelong fun hog.
Colnago e Campagnolo

by Weenie


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Vagabond
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Location: Washington State and the Colorado Front Range.

by Vagabond

Marin wrote:Everyone believing that carbon is dangerous needs to watch this Santa Cruz carbon frame test, it's really amazing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xreZdUBqpJs


And for further proof of strength one can always watch Martyn Ashton on his Colnago in "Road Bike Party 2." It's such a shame he was so badly injured. He handled a bike better than anyone I've ever seen.
Colnago e Campagnolo

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