Gravel tires vs Road tires (pure speed)

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Oswald
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by Oswald

On my cyclocross bike I have a set of Grifo XS tubulars. They have a diamond profile in the middle and small knobs on the side. There is probably a tubeless tire that has a similar thread. And a thread like that is very fast on tarmac and also works on gravel.

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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

Hey Oswald, sounds as if these knobs are made for cornering control.
For speed on tarmac, i guess the lesser knobs aso sticking out is better (hehe.. less drag :wink: )
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Tamu8104
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by Tamu8104

MattSoutherden wrote:
Do your group rides always hammer along at the limit?

According to http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/ A decent road tyre would soak up about 12-13 Watts. They tested the 37mm Vittoria Voyager (a light touring tyre) at 18-20 Watts. I would imagine the lighter, more supple Compass would be a bit less than that.

Even a fast 2.2 MTB tyre is only sucking 20 of those glorious Watts.

Bit tyres may _feel_ slow, but most of it is above the collar.


The group rides I do are fast rides, mostly race pace and tactics with very strong local racers. I can stay with everyone on the flats and the descents but I do have to work harder. Sustaining an extra 10-20 watts over 2 hours is enough to impact the legs ability to go with the top riders on the selective portions of the course. It's not just a head thing, my PM numbers back it up.
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fromtrektocolnago
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by fromtrektocolnago

Not sure what a gravel tire is, but my gravel bike wears Compass and my road bike Michelin Pro-4's. I don't see how the two can compare though. One is a 23 mm the other a 32 and they are inflated quite diffrently. They both are well suited for their intended roles. I don't expect my gravel bike to ride as fast on the road or m road bike to handle well on gravel. Isn't that why we have two bikes suited for different roles? I'm just not getting the question.
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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

bikerector wrote:
wheelsONfire wrote:Many are very much satisfied with G-One. Hm.... i changed to Hutchinson Black Mamba CX.
Sadly i can't ride as i have a muscle bleeding so i am not sure what is the fastest of these two.

I think Maxxis Re-fuse looks like something that may be a contender? Question is how ride feel is on those?
Same time i realize that 35mm are truly nice on the gravel. I wonder if jumping down in size is a bad idea?


I road the 32mm tubeless refuse in a gravel race last weekend and I was pretty impressed with how it handled the loose conditions. The road was recently graded which made the tire choice poor for the conditions and something wider would have been better but I've never been on gravel roads that were so loose outside of driveways with the pebbly stuff that you just sink through. I ran the psi around 45f/55r, I weigh 100kg and I was able to ride everything pretty well. The refuse rolls well on pavement for a heavy tire but it's not a road race tire by any stretch of the imagination. Before the 32mm tubeless on my gravel bike I was riding 28mm on tubed on my road bike for rides that were 60/40 paved/gravel on a regular basis so I was excited when the 32 tubeless came out. I'm waiting for a 28mm tubeless so I can use it on my road bike and never have to worry about a puncture again.

They were a little more work than normal to setup tubeless than my maxxis mtb tires but about the same as any other road tubeless I've tried which seem to setup a little harder.



If you are not "fixed" in that ideal of 28mm, i would test Schwalbe S-One 30mm tubeless.
This is a fast tire!

I doubt you will puncture on this. I rode mine a few times in really crappy conditions.
No punctures, what i did notice was the speeed which certainly was not anything i complained at.

G-One (35mm) is also fast if you use a bit higher inflation. What i find a bit of difficult, is finding the sweet spot pressure for G-One.
Seems as it's either a bit too compressed and goes pretty seemless into being what feels like a bit too high on pressure.
This is perhaps the mild complaint i actually have for these.

I had easier to get Hutchinson Black Mamba CX just about perfect.

Some roads are so evil here, i am wondering if i should try Maxxis Rambler EXO/TR 700*40.
Seems very light which kind of make my interest peak :mrgreen:
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bikerector
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by bikerector

I have some room in the bike frame but I thine 28mm tires is about as big as I can go with my brake calipers.

The ramblers seem pretty solid from what I've read and on paper. Gravel cyclist did a review or are in the process of doing a review. Being new there isn't a ton of info on them. Generally speaking, I prefer a smooth tread tire for gravel simply because I tend to do a lot more mixed paved/gravel instead of solely gravel rides and knobs get wrecked quickly on pavement IME.

http://www.gravelcyclist.com/bicycle-te ... 0mm-tires/

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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

Same here. But the gravel roads (a very bad word for what i am riding on) i cycle on are pure crazy.
Sometimes i think for myself, what the hell am i doing here. I kind of figure that anything more narrow than Huthinson Black Mamba CX would kill the rims in an instant.
But you are right on, the dynamics between terrain makes optimal impossible.

I just wish Hutchinson hade fatter tires than 34mm. For those that ride pretty normal gravel, i would say Black Mamba CX is a great option!
It won't slow you down, great grip, supple and it's fast and resonably light weight.
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spud
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by spud

I've just started doing some riding on Kenda Flint Ridge 35c. Have to say I like them. Can't quantify the increase in rolling resistance, and yes, i can definitely feel the increase in inertia, but they certainly aren't a buzz kill on pavement. off road I've been happy with the feel and steering response. They mounted up very easily to my Chinese tubeless rims, and hold air very well.

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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

It's a tough cookie getting a grip on where to go from certain platforms.

I think for what it's worth, Hutchinson Black Mamba CX is truly great.
However, if i would just have that in a larger format, that is what i am looking for.
Currenlty Hutchinsons focus is at the new Sector 32.
That is not the right direction for me personally.
I ride too much too demanding terrain.

It's simple, really quick tires that actually handles all sorts of terrain but increase the width of Black Mamba CX.
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ajh
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by ajh

I used to run the old gen Hutchinson Piranha cx tubeless and they were great on all surfaces except for mud and loose surfaces. They are very fast on Tarmac and hardpack

I changed to Bontrager CX0 tires as I was able to get a deal. They are great on all surfaces but mud. They are a little slow on Tarmac until they have about 200-300 miles under them. They have a little more grip than the Piranha in dirt corners

I got a deal on some Kenda Happy Mediums. They are good on just about all surfaces but they are a little slow in loose conditions as the rounded profile seems to dig in a little and not float. They have excellent traction however so this is the trade off. They also seem to get faster on hardpack as they wear.

I just ordered some new gen Piranha CX2 so I will let you know about those in a few weeks.

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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

Great AJH!

Thanks!
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ajh
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by ajh

So I received thr Piranha 2s earlier than expected and put them on already. As before they are extremely fast tires. My speed was up 1-2 mph on hardpack and Tarmac compared to the happy medium's. I went up 2-4 mph on loose/sandy gravel as they float better and had less friction. On damp hardpack dirt they has less sucction and I was 3 mph faster. I got 3 very long KOM's and they are not even worn in yet.

The trade off was cornering traction in loose surfaces but I am also not sure if this was partially due to higher speeds.

Also they are not for wet. Mud and wet grass are not what this tire is for.

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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

AJH, have you tested Maxxis Rambler EXO/TR and / or Silkshield 700*40?

I run them now.
Really kick ass tires when you go off tarmac.

Seems as less wide tires offers better speed on tarmac.
Or if it's the pattern of thread that interacts to some degree?

I have not tested the Piranha 2 (what width are you using?), only Black Mamba CX (34mm tubeless).
However, wider tires on gravel or trails is not a bad idea.

But marrying tarmac speed with gravel traction/ speed and comfort is less easy.
I have found no tire faster than Black Mamba CX so far.
Schwalbe S-One (30mm) is a dang fast tire, but too narrow for 50% of what i ride.
Schwalbe G-One does not corner as good as Maxxis Rambler 700*40.
Ramblers inspire confidence.
I am not riding CX, so i don't feel i can comment on pure CX tires.
I see they often are narrower than gravel tires though!
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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

Double post!
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Tomstr
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by Tomstr

Where did you get the Black Mamba's? They seem to be sold out everywhere.
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