@OhPinchy, sungod is correct. I recommend that you avoid the type of valve extender that fastens like a sleeve over the valve core. Instead, try to find a version that works as you have described in your post. I like Vittoria, myself: http://www.wheelbuilder.com/vittoria-va ... nders.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The reason I like that type of extender is specifically not for the use of sealant (although, if you chose to use a sealant in an emergency, that would probably be an issue, too). the reason that I do not like the sleeve-type extenders is that, without being able to actually open and close the valve, the system is made less reliable.
Good luck.
Glueing tubulars [the tubular thread]
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The spirit of this board is to compile and organize wheels and tires related discussions.
If a new wheel tech is released, (say for example, TPU tubes, a brand new tire, or a new rim standard), feel free to start the discussion in the popular "Road". Your topic will eventually be moved here!
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Hi,
For extenders and sealants I use Tufo.
As much as I don't like (as in hate) their tyres these accessories are very good.
They're very light (aluminium) and do the job.
Many other companies use the same concept. They're available in some sort of alloy (heavy) and in aluminium as well as various lengths.
This, either from Tufo or a variety of other companies. Continental and Vittoria only offer some heavy bronze ones, you want the aluminium ones.
Their sealant also happens to be great. The best I can think of.
Ciao,
For extenders and sealants I use Tufo.
As much as I don't like (as in hate) their tyres these accessories are very good.
They're very light (aluminium) and do the job.
Many other companies use the same concept. They're available in some sort of alloy (heavy) and in aluminium as well as various lengths.
This, either from Tufo or a variety of other companies. Continental and Vittoria only offer some heavy bronze ones, you want the aluminium ones.
Their sealant also happens to be great. The best I can think of.
Ciao,
Being a snob is an expensive hobby.
To be clear, and at the risk of being presumptuous, I believe my Belgian brother is referring to sealant to use in an emergency and is not suggesting that you pre-load a good tubular with sealant. I know the Vittorias are heavier, but I like them. 
I prefer brass nipples, too. 
Looking forward to the tire choices today at E3 Harelbeke! Are you going, Frank?
I prefer brass nipples, too. Looking forward to the tire choices today at E3 Harelbeke! Are you going, Frank?
Thanks a lot for the pointers folks, all taken onboard. I popped into my LBS last night and the valve extenders they had were Continentals and they do the job perfectly – no increase in pressure drop overnight from what I’d normally expect with latex tubes, so all good there it seems. The PTFE tape really gives confidence that the seal will hold tight.
Only bummer is I stupidly bought 70mm extenders thinking ‘50mm rims plus 20mm exposed for the pump to fix onto is perfect’ but totally forgot about the valve already on the tires, which must be 30mm long itself. So now I have this ridiculously long valve. Bar it looking a bit stupid and weighing a couple of grams more than a shorter one, is there any practical issue with this? I’d prefer not to delay things further by going to get shorter valves, so will plough ahead with these if I can. I’ll wrap the valve in PTFE where it will meet the hole in the rim to stop it rattling.
I used the acetone with nitrile gloves last night to wipe down the rims to prep them for glueing – even using a mask in a very well ventilated area, man that stuff is toxic….I’ll be limiting my use of it to the bare minimum – now I just need to quickly wipe the braking surfaces after glueing is finished and the tire is in situ, right?
Only bummer is I stupidly bought 70mm extenders thinking ‘50mm rims plus 20mm exposed for the pump to fix onto is perfect’ but totally forgot about the valve already on the tires, which must be 30mm long itself. So now I have this ridiculously long valve. Bar it looking a bit stupid and weighing a couple of grams more than a shorter one, is there any practical issue with this? I’d prefer not to delay things further by going to get shorter valves, so will plough ahead with these if I can. I’ll wrap the valve in PTFE where it will meet the hole in the rim to stop it rattling.
I used the acetone with nitrile gloves last night to wipe down the rims to prep them for glueing – even using a mask in a very well ventilated area, man that stuff is toxic….I’ll be limiting my use of it to the bare minimum – now I just need to quickly wipe the braking surfaces after glueing is finished and the tire is in situ, right?
Hi,
Yes. Either as an emergency repair on the road although I much prefer to mount a spare, pre-glued tub, or as a repair at home which works fine for small punctures.
I must have a bunch of these brass Vittoria extenders in my storage room in the basement. I switched to the otherwise identical aluminium ones as they're lighter in can be had in all kinds of lengths.
Schwalbe also offers them in 28mm length (I think) which is just enough for a 50mm deep rim a la Bora.
Maybe Conti also offers the same alu ones, not sure. They do offer the same ones as Vittoria does though.
The Tufo style extenders are the best IMHO, I do not even use plumber's tape as they just refuse to leak.
Geoff, I'll be watching the E3 Harelbeke from the comfort of my chair. It's nearly freezing point here with a pretty strong north-eastern wind.
@OhPinchy: standard stem lengths are commonly either 36mm or 42mm. Vittoria uses 42mm stem IIRC.
For a Bora wheel (50mm) and using Veloflex tyres (36mm stem) I use a 28mm alu extender (Schwalbe or Tufo, they are the same anyhow). 36 + 28 = 64 mm which is ample for a pumphead.
The only disadvantage of an overly long extender is that it adds weight and can potentially unbalance the dynamic balance of the wheel.
Ciao,
Geoff wrote:To be clear, and at the risk of being presumptuous, I believe my Belgian brother is referring to sealant to use in an emergency and is not suggesting that you pre-load a good tubular with sealant. I know the Vittorias are heavier, but I like them.
Looking forward to the tire choices today at E3 Harelbeke! Are you going, Frank?
Yes. Either as an emergency repair on the road although I much prefer to mount a spare, pre-glued tub, or as a repair at home which works fine for small punctures.
I must have a bunch of these brass Vittoria extenders in my storage room in the basement. I switched to the otherwise identical aluminium ones as they're lighter in can be had in all kinds of lengths.
Schwalbe also offers them in 28mm length (I think) which is just enough for a 50mm deep rim a la Bora.
Maybe Conti also offers the same alu ones, not sure. They do offer the same ones as Vittoria does though.
The Tufo style extenders are the best IMHO, I do not even use plumber's tape as they just refuse to leak.
Geoff, I'll be watching the E3 Harelbeke from the comfort of my chair. It's nearly freezing point here with a pretty strong north-eastern wind.
Funny how tastes can differ, huh?I prefer brass nipples, too.
@OhPinchy: standard stem lengths are commonly either 36mm or 42mm. Vittoria uses 42mm stem IIRC.
For a Bora wheel (50mm) and using Veloflex tyres (36mm stem) I use a 28mm alu extender (Schwalbe or Tufo, they are the same anyhow). 36 + 28 = 64 mm which is ample for a pumphead.
The only disadvantage of an overly long extender is that it adds weight and can potentially unbalance the dynamic balance of the wheel.
Ciao,
Being a snob is an expensive hobby.
Seems to be a nice tire for popping wheelies, the Kenda.
http://www.kendausa.com/en/home/bicycle ... olare.aspx
Do they make these themselves?
http://www.kendausa.com/en/home/bicycle ... olare.aspx
Do they make these themselves?
So I’m nearly there on this epic adventure to become a tubbie! It was actually strangely satisfying and rewarding, so far at least I put the first coat on the rims on Saturday and the second yesterday, with one coat on the basetape of the tire yesterday. I hung the wheels in my shed from wire clothes hangers, put glue in the section between 3 spoke holes at a time, direct from the tube, and then brushed that out onto the rims. I used fine sandpaper to smooth out the very few bumps there were between coats and blew away the dust. For the tire, I pumped it up a bit and put it on a table, rolled it so the base tape was facing upwards and poured the glue onto the base tape and then brushed it out to only the full width of the basetape, then rolled the basetape back to face inward. I was tempted to leave a 1cm gap unglued near the valve but for peace of mind, didn’t in the end.
I used 2 tubes of Mastik One in total for 2 coats on 2 rims and 1 coat on 2 tires – I felt the coats were reasonably thin, does that sound about right? Just wanted to outline my method to see if there’s anything I could improve.
I actually went and changed the valve extenders to 40mm rather than live with the eyesore of the overly long valve bugging me, and verified it was airtight for 24 hours before putting the glue on.
So I now plan to put one more coat on the basetape and then immediately fit the tire, stretching out the valve section to avoid any bumps and hopefully it goes on smoothly. Then I inflate to max pressure of 9 bar and roll the wheel on the ground with my full weight on it, right? I got almost zero glue on the rims up to now so didn’t need any clean up but am sure once I put the tires on I’ll have glue to clean up – is a rag with with spirits the best way to do this? Is it any issue if I don't have time to do the final coat and installation tonight and leave it another 24 hours to tomorrow?
For my spare tire, I’ll also glue that with just one coat of glue, right? I’ll fold it up the way Geoff shared earlier in this thread but figure it’s best to wrap it in some material to avoid it getting stuck to things while stored – I assume a plastic bag would be troublesome, so is a bit of cloth best for this?
I used 2 tubes of Mastik One in total for 2 coats on 2 rims and 1 coat on 2 tires – I felt the coats were reasonably thin, does that sound about right? Just wanted to outline my method to see if there’s anything I could improve.
I actually went and changed the valve extenders to 40mm rather than live with the eyesore of the overly long valve bugging me, and verified it was airtight for 24 hours before putting the glue on.
So I now plan to put one more coat on the basetape and then immediately fit the tire, stretching out the valve section to avoid any bumps and hopefully it goes on smoothly. Then I inflate to max pressure of 9 bar and roll the wheel on the ground with my full weight on it, right? I got almost zero glue on the rims up to now so didn’t need any clean up but am sure once I put the tires on I’ll have glue to clean up – is a rag with with spirits the best way to do this? Is it any issue if I don't have time to do the final coat and installation tonight and leave it another 24 hours to tomorrow?
For my spare tire, I’ll also glue that with just one coat of glue, right? I’ll fold it up the way Geoff shared earlier in this thread but figure it’s best to wrap it in some material to avoid it getting stuck to things while stored – I assume a plastic bag would be troublesome, so is a bit of cloth best for this?
sounds fine, you're a lot neater than me
applying the final coat to basetape makes you a geoffist, rather than a rim-gluing frankist like myself, but unlike some sects there is peace and understanding between the two, so that's ok
i keep my spare tightly folded in a ziploc freezer bag, so rain/sweat/whatever don't get at it, it all goes in a jersey pocket with pump and minitool etc.
applying the final coat to basetape makes you a geoffist, rather than a rim-gluing frankist like myself, but unlike some sects there is peace and understanding between the two, so that's ok
i keep my spare tightly folded in a ziploc freezer bag, so rain/sweat/whatever don't get at it, it all goes in a jersey pocket with pump and minitool etc.
'Geoffist', that's hilarious!
@Oh Pinchy, either way you go with the last coat of glue, i suspect you will be fine. The only reason I do it that way is that is the way I was taught when I was a Cadet. It has worked really well, so I don't have any reason to change.
The only things I would add is to reiterate that: i) really stretching the tire on using your bodyweight will really help you installing it; and, ii) once you have the tire mounted on the rim, just put enough air in it to 'round it out' so that you can manually 'adjust' it so the tread runs nice and straight before you put pressure into it and let it cure.
With respect to carrying a spare, I usually just use an old tubular that was pulled before it flatted. I don't usually bother with plastic, I just wrap it in brown craft paper (again, because that was how I was taught). That keeps the sun off it and keeps it clean, too.
@Oh Pinchy, either way you go with the last coat of glue, i suspect you will be fine. The only reason I do it that way is that is the way I was taught when I was a Cadet. It has worked really well, so I don't have any reason to change.
The only things I would add is to reiterate that: i) really stretching the tire on using your bodyweight will really help you installing it; and, ii) once you have the tire mounted on the rim, just put enough air in it to 'round it out' so that you can manually 'adjust' it so the tread runs nice and straight before you put pressure into it and let it cure.
With respect to carrying a spare, I usually just use an old tubular that was pulled before it flatted. I don't usually bother with plastic, I just wrap it in brown craft paper (again, because that was how I was taught). That keeps the sun off it and keeps it clean, too.
I just got through HALF of my first experience glueing tubulars for the first time and now I have a couple bleeding fingers and am going to hold off on the final glueing of the second tire until tomorrow.
I am guessing that maybe I didn't stretch the tires quite enough before beginning the glueing process. I put both tires (Conti Force/Attack combo that were both 15gr overweight btw) onto my rims and inflated to 140 psi for about 16 hours since they seemed pretty damn easy to put on at first and even easier to put on after the short stretch. I didn't take into account how much harder the tires were going to be to mount after two layers of Mastik One had cured for 24 hours each and and two cured layers and one fresh layer on the rim. Live and learn, but I think I will give my tires a longer stretch next time.
Thanks to everyone in this thread for all the good tips so far even though I've apparently made things hard on myself through my impatience.
I am guessing that maybe I didn't stretch the tires quite enough before beginning the glueing process. I put both tires (Conti Force/Attack combo that were both 15gr overweight btw) onto my rims and inflated to 140 psi for about 16 hours since they seemed pretty damn easy to put on at first and even easier to put on after the short stretch. I didn't take into account how much harder the tires were going to be to mount after two layers of Mastik One had cured for 24 hours each and and two cured layers and one fresh layer on the rim. Live and learn, but I think I will give my tires a longer stretch next time.
Thanks to everyone in this thread for all the good tips so far even though I've apparently made things hard on myself through my impatience.
-
HammerTime2
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What's the difference between the Attack tubular and the Conti Competition 22 mm? Put another way, what's the difference between riding a {Competition 22 mm front/Force tubular rear} and {Attack tubular front/Force tubular rear}?
Hi,
Tubular glue aka rim cement is fine for a couple of years at least.
A glue job done properly should, and in my experience does, effectively outlast most tyres' life expectancy which would be roughly 5.000 km at best.
In most cases the tyre dies well before the glue does.
Ciao,
Tubular glue aka rim cement is fine for a couple of years at least.
A glue job done properly should, and in my experience does, effectively outlast most tyres' life expectancy which would be roughly 5.000 km at best.
In most cases the tyre dies well before the glue does.
Ciao,
Being a snob is an expensive hobby.
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Hey HammerTime,
The Conti Competition 22mm and Conti Attack seem pretty similar; same casing and puncture protection as best I can tell. The tread on the Attack is completely slick down the center with some texturing on the shoulders whereas the Competition is textured across the entire tire. The Competition is supposed to weigh 260gr and the Attack is supposed to weigh 240gr (mine came in at 255). I am also not sure if Continental changes the "Black Chili" rubber compound across different tires or if all "Black Chili" rubber is the same regardless of tire model. I definitely read somewhere that implied the Attack vs the Force had softer rubber, but I have no idea if this is actually true.
I'll be happy to share my impression of these tires once I get a few miles on them, but I'll only be able to compare to other clinchers since I haven't ever spent much time on tubulars before. I can say now that the clincher version of Attack/Force is my favorite tire setup I've ever used.
The Conti Competition 22mm and Conti Attack seem pretty similar; same casing and puncture protection as best I can tell. The tread on the Attack is completely slick down the center with some texturing on the shoulders whereas the Competition is textured across the entire tire. The Competition is supposed to weigh 260gr and the Attack is supposed to weigh 240gr (mine came in at 255). I am also not sure if Continental changes the "Black Chili" rubber compound across different tires or if all "Black Chili" rubber is the same regardless of tire model. I definitely read somewhere that implied the Attack vs the Force had softer rubber, but I have no idea if this is actually true.
I'll be happy to share my impression of these tires once I get a few miles on them, but I'll only be able to compare to other clinchers since I haven't ever spent much time on tubulars before. I can say now that the clincher version of Attack/Force is my favorite tire setup I've ever used.
