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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 2:23 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:39 am
Posts: 172
I know there is a ton of t/c discussion, but still need an advice on subject.
Didnt really find reviews on F4R tubulars with dt240 hubs.
I'm swapping wheels and first thought on getting racing quatro. Good height and decent price.
For about same money I was offered F4R dt 240 driven 500 and already installed tubes.

Got 0 experience on tubulars and this set of wheels would be my all-rounders. Rarely cycle in rain with my roadbike, so braking isnt an issue. Flats mainly, so weight difference is debatable.
Going tubular just makes me think twice.
And havent heard anything about F4R.

Some advice?

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Posted: Tue May 16, 2017 2:23 pm 


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 3:23 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:21 pm
Posts: 141
Do you have a specific question?
You know the tradeoffs with the T/C. You know how you're using the wheelset. DT240s are good hubs. Fulcrum hubs are good enough. Fulcrum spokes are a PITA to get replacements on (just buy some ahead of time). FFWD rims are just open mold TW sourced rims, so no magic - but is there any magic really? I think TOUR INT magazine did an aero test of the Quattro wheels and a similar wheelset to the FFWDs. Is one going to be significantly better than the other, probably not.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 5:38 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:39 am
Posts: 172
The tour aerotest didn't have any FFWD wheelsets, so I would like to know how they handle.
Even as they were similar, open mold wheelsets seem to vary a lot. Farsport has good products and friend of mine had really shitty pair (prolly cheapest from ali)

So if anyone could give some first hand experience on FFWD F4R and even ridden both - and some thoughts, that would be appreciated.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:44 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2012 1:16 pm
Posts: 34
I use both clinchers and tubs.

Tubs are fine to use on the road. Either carry a pre-glued spare or can of Vittoria Pit Stop. I swear by Conti Comps. I'd rather use clinchers in the wet-just my preference.

I had the FFWD F6R tubs on 240's and really liked them-very light, fast, aero and 8/10 for stiffness. I didn't get that much use out of them outside of racing so I sold them on. They stayed true during my ownership. I'd own another set tomorrow if they were cheap enough. FFWD backup is excellent, a no quibble rim/rebuild crash replacement at 'cost'. They're handbuilt in Holland.

Fulcrums are decent but heavier. I've had a couple of sets, they were reliable but underwhelming.
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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:55 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 7:45 pm
Posts: 4433
Location: Natovi Landing
@Ginster - I would certainly see that rig coming on a dark night!!

I've had F4Rs in the "squad" for a few years and they are really decent wheels. Stout, stiff, roll nicely. Really pretty close to Boras if not quite there

Of your two options I'd rather have the FFWDs, but the main issue is T/C and what your competence is

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PostPosted: Wed May 17, 2017 2:28 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:39 am
Posts: 172
Where I come from there's a saying that You should try everything except your relatives and folk dancing.
As F4Rs are decently priced set and the more I read about tubulars is like, why haven't I ridden with them before?!

Just lacked knowledge on F4R to encourage to take this leap. Thanks for that.


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PostPosted: Wed May 17, 2017 4:51 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 7:45 pm
Posts: 4433
Location: Natovi Landing
Vermu wrote:
Where I come from there's a saying that You should try everything except your relatives and folk dancing.
As F4Rs are decently priced set and the more I read about tubulars is like, why haven't I ridden with them before?!

Just lacked knowledge on F4R to encourage to take this leap. Thanks for that.


You won't be disappointed with the wheels at least. The only issue is whether you get on with tubulars

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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 1:53 am 
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Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 7:39 am
Posts: 1659
Location: Canada
Without looking the tubular/clincher comparison, F4R are good wheels, but less stiff in the back compared to Fulcrum/Campy G3 2:1 spoke pattern. DT240 are good hubs, but the spoke geometry is not the best if you want the stiffest wheels lateraly. Braking performance also goes to Fulcrum/Campy with the diamant surface treatment and Campy red pads.
I know a racer who has F4R tubulars and bought some Bora one 35 as a second set. He kept the black prince pads installed and was complaining about braking performance on his Bora. I told him to use the red campy pads instead as it is the only pads he should use with those wheels. Next time I saw him he was amazed at the braking. Night and day and better than his F4R. I also hear a lot of strong riders complaining with FFWD rear wheel touching pads when they sprint or climbing. I never hear that with Campy/Fulcrum.

I would rather go with bora one 35 tubular or even Fulcrum 40T over the F4R. 40T comes with cult ceramic bearings. There is not a big price difference compared to F4R with DT240s.

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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 10:57 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 7:45 pm
Posts: 4433
Location: Natovi Landing
ferrarista wrote:
Without looking the tubular/clincher comparison, F4R are good wheels, but less stiff in the back compared to Fulcrum/Campy G3 2:1 spoke pattern. DT240 are good hubs, but the spoke geometry is not the best if you want the stiffest wheels lateraly. Braking performance also goes to Fulcrum/Campy with the diamant surface treatment and Campy red pads.
I know a racer who has F4R tubulars and bought some Bora one 35 as a second set. He kept the black prince pads installed and was complaining about braking performance on his Bora. I told him to use the red campy pads instead as it is the only pads he should use with those wheels. Next time I saw him he was amazed at the braking. Night and day and better than his F4R. I also hear a lot of strong riders complaining with FFWD rear wheel touching pads when they sprint or climbing. I never hear that with Campy/Fulcrum.

I would rather go with bora one 35 tubular or even Fulcrum 40T over the F4R. 40T comes with cult ceramic bearings. There is not a big price difference compared to F4R with DT240s.


I have the FFWD with the FFWD hubs rather than the DTs and also have three sets of Boras. Overall impression F4R are slightly less stiff than Bora 50s (current iteration), though not noticeably less stiff than Bora 35s (current iteration). No touching of pads (75kg/1300w) on any of them. Braking is about the same ... though you get a bit more noise with FFWDs, but really it's very good on all. Overall though Boras are a bit better yes, and the wider rim doesn't hurt

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Stiff, Light, Aero - Pick Three!! :thumbup:


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Posted: Thu May 18, 2017 10:57 am 


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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 11:09 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2010 6:39 am
Posts: 172
Oh and do remember that I would get F4R for less than 1k€. So apparently if able to live with tubulars - the choice is simple and a good start to tubeing.

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