DuraAce C24 9100 or custom HED Belgium plus build?

Everything about building wheels, glueing tubs, etc.
zilla24
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:54 pm

by zilla24

Thanks everyone for the guidance and comments, I've put the thought of C24s behind me. Now to focus on which wheel/hub combo to go with!

by Weenie


fromtrektocolnago
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:15 pm

by fromtrektocolnago

I"m not familiar with the HED(never rode one) but I"m on Dura Ace C-24's on on C-59. I bought them for climbing and long rides. I could not be more pleased. Have the C-24's for a few years now. Last two years I did 13,000 miles on them. The year before over 5,000. They've been very reliable.
Colnago C-59 (Dura Ace)
Firefly(Ultegra)
Trek 5200(ultegra)

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Asteroid
Posts: 209
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 8:43 pm
Location: Los Angeles, California

by Asteroid

zilla24 wrote:Thanks everyone for the guidance and comments, I've put the thought of C24s behind me. Now to focus on which wheel/hub combo to go with!


One rider posts about breaking a front spoke, and another talks about his Ultegra wheelset's supposed shortcomings, so your take is that C24's are not good?

Way way more posts exist around this forum touting the tremoundous attributes of the C24's. You could buy a set of these great wheels, PLUS a decent backup set (for inclement weather or rough roads) if you've got any reservations.

My experience over 15k miles? Perfectly straight wheels (never needed truing) and smooth hub operation (easily rebuildable every 4k miles). Like you, I weigh 170 lbs and over the course of my mileage have encountered more than my share of potholes and bumpy roads. Looking closely at the solid hub/spoke/rim construction, in my opinion it looks impossible to break a spoke. So much impressed with the quality and ride, I bought a brand new set as my backup!
Oldbie

zilla24
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:54 pm

by zilla24

Asteroid wrote:
zilla24 wrote:Thanks everyone for the guidance and comments, I've put the thought of C24s behind me. Now to focus on which wheel/hub combo to go with!


One rider posts about breaking a front spoke, and another talks about his Ultegra wheelset's supposed shortcomings, so your take is that C24's are not good?

Way way more posts exist around this forum touting the tremoundous attributes of the C24's. You could buy a set of these great wheels, PLUS a decent backup set (for inclement weather or rough roads) if you've got any reservations.

My experience over 15k miles? Perfectly straight wheels (never needed truing) and smooth hub operation (easily rebuildable every 4k miles). Like you, I weigh 170 lbs and over the course of my mileage have encountered more than my share of potholes and bumpy roads. Looking closely at the solid hub/spoke/rim construction, in my opinion it looks impossible to break a spoke. So much impressed with the quality and ride, I bought a brand new set as my backup!


I never said C24s aren't good. I appreciate everyone's input, the first few comments confirmed some of my concerns about spoke breakage and are leaning me towards a custom build. Your experience seems great with C24s, a friend from work has had a similar trouble free experience with 9000 series C24s. He did however have a small issue with the carbon delaminating on the both rims, supposedly not a structural thing.

The current price and hubs on C24s are what kept them in the running for me, but with HED rim width and durability (I'm sure there are other great rim options too) I'm really leaning towards a custom build.

numberSix
Posts: 67
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:53 pm

by numberSix

I've got about 28k miles on a set of HED C2 Belgiums, 24/28, 2x2x2x, Sapim xray spokes, Chris King R45 hubs. Excellent trouble free wheelset, and surprisingly aero compared to the R11 Shimanos they replaced. The rim wear dots are about gone.

The Shimano low spoke count is nice in crosswinds, but out of the saddle I could see/feel the front wheel flex.

A quick look at Ribble has the C24s at $454(!). Mail order on a the HEDs will be $900 from say Glory ycles or Excel Sports.

pdlpsher1
Posts: 1319
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:09 pm
Location: CO

by pdlpsher1

The C24 still has the old school narrow rim width. The Belgium plus' 21mm internal width and 25mm external width is awesome. I hand built a set for my tandem and they are very high quality rims and bomb proof. You have to use thick tubes as thin tubes will start to stretch too thin due to the extra internal volume. Conti 25mm 4000 balloons to 28mm wide and the 28mm 4000 balloons to 32mm wide.


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kervelo
Posts: 294
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:58 am
Location: Finland

by kervelo

pdlpsher1 wrote:You have to use thick tubes as thin tubes will start to stretch too thin due to the extra internal volume


You can still use normal thin tubes, as long as you choose the correct width. For example, Vittoria has a wider 25-28 mm model of its latex tubes in addition to the standard 19-24 mm model.

pdlpsher1
Posts: 1319
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:09 pm
Location: CO

by pdlpsher1

kervelo wrote:
pdlpsher1 wrote:You have to use thick tubes as thin tubes will start to stretch too thin due to the extra internal volume


You can still use normal thin tubes, as long as you choose the correct width. For example, Vittoria has a wider 25-28 mm model of its latex tubes in addition to the standard 19-24 mm model.


I don't think this matters much. I just use a small diameter thick tube (100g) and it will stretch out. I was using 80g tubes but start to get numerous pinhole leaks while using the Conti 4000 25mm with the Belgium + rims. I don't think there's a 100g tube made for wider tires. I don't think I want anything heavier than 100g.


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zilla24
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:54 pm

by zilla24

What would you guys recommend as far as hub choice? I was considering the R45 chris king hubs, but it seems as though they require quite a bit of service. DT Swiss 240s seem to be reliable and low maintenance.

pdlpsher1
Posts: 1319
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:09 pm
Location: CO

by pdlpsher1

zilla24 wrote:What would you guys recommend as far as hub choice? I was considering the R45 chris king hubs, but it seems as though they require quite a bit of service. DT Swiss 240s seem to be reliable and low maintenance.


Why not go with Dura Ace hubs? Although I don't like the C24 due to its narrow rim, I once had a Shimano C50 and think that Dura Ace hubs are the absolute best. After 20,000 miles I took apart the hubs and the inside looked as good as new, with the green colored OEM grease still present and no dirt contamination whatsoever. And they have been proven to roll with the least amount of friction as angular contact bearings have low drag seals as compared to radial bearings.


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Bigger Gear
Posts: 258
Joined: Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:58 pm
Location: Wet coast, Canada

by Bigger Gear

Agree, the Dura-Ace hubs are a great choice. Easy to service plus a titanium freehub body that does not get gouged up compared to alloy like King or DT 240. Also the White Industries T11 hubset is a nice choice if you want something in an anodized colour. Also has titanium freehub body.

zilla24
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:54 pm

by zilla24

Does anyone have an opinion about white industries T11 hubs? They seem well made and easy to service, also like the titanium freehub.

Bigger Gear
Posts: 258
Joined: Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:58 pm
Location: Wet coast, Canada

by Bigger Gear

zilla24 wrote:Does anyone have an opinion about white industries T11 hubs? They seem well made and easy to service, also like the titanium freehub.


I just received a set of HED Belgium+ built on White T11 hubs with Sapim CX-Ray. I'll get some time on them and report back, but I really need the weather to improve!! They are on the princess bike which has hardly seen the road in 2017 because it has been so wet. So far from a visual inspection standpoint the T11 hubs seem to be nice. I chose the 48T ratchet version of the freehub.

I chose the T11 over King R45s mostly because I have had a set of King (10spd only version) and while they are beautifully built I think they are very overpriced and require a little more maintenance than I expected. Nothing major but for a wheel than never saw the rain I found I needed to pull it apart every couple of months and lube the ring drive and O-rings or it would start to creak. Plus the alloy driveshell is REALLY soft. It gets chewed up even worse than a DT 240S.

Multebear
Posts: 894
Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

zilla24 wrote:Does anyone have an opinion about white industries T11 hubs? They seem well made and easy to service, also like the titanium freehub.


They are the bomb. Best looking hubs out there. Really good craftsmanship. High quality and they have titanium free hub body. What's not to like. Well ok, they are a bit heavier than other hubs. But if you're +170 lbs, 50 grams non rotational weight shouldn't bother you. Just look at them !! (they have other colors if pink isn't your thing). Only little funny drawback is, they don't fit in a bike stand.

Dura Ace hubs are very good as well - with titanium free hub body and all.

DT 240s are more meh... They work well, have proven their design over the years, easy serviceable, easy to get new parts and so on. But they have a terrible free hub body, that very quickly develops bitemarks from cassettes. And they are just so boring. Everyone's got them. Several production wheel manufacturers even use them. The boring choice.

So do the CK's. The CK's are probably the raciest hubs out there, and the free hub sound is just pure sex. But the bitemarks are a PITA. Especially since a new CK free hub body is pricy.

You might also look at other rim options than Belgiums. There are a lot of other options out there more reasonable priced. Several Kinlin models e.g. 31T and XC279. DT R460R if you want something very affordable. Stanz ZTR Alpha 340 if you want light. Flo30 if you want very aero.

Another advantage of custom build wheels is, that if you wear down the rim, it is easy replaceable. Same goes for broken spokes. And you're not limited to use the same rims. If you're willing to buy new spokes as well, you can try another type of rim as well.


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by Weenie


zilla24
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:54 pm

by zilla24

Guys thanks for the awesome responses on the white industries T11s.

Biggergear - I am very curious how you like them once you get some miles on them. I watched some YouTube videos on them yesterday and the bearing preload looks very simple to adjust if necessary, just not sure how well the setscrew holds in place or if it marks the axle.

All considered I think the T11s will be my hub choice.

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